Listen to the episode here.

Grab your weighted blanket and settle in with a mug of calming tea. You’ll need it. Angie kicks things into high gear when she shares the story of the legendary female samurai, Tomoe Gozen. Listen along to Theresa thinking she knows more of the story than she actually does.

Theresa takes a sharp left turn by sharing the story of the Lone Fir Cemetery and the Chinese Immigrants who built Portland, Oregon. In true Theresa fashion, she gets us all aggregated before surprisingly ending on a ray of hope.

This episode pairs well with:

Blood Soaked Battle Angel
Yasuke
The Shanghai Tunnels

Transcript:

Theresa: Hi, and welcome to the Unhinged History Podcast. The podcast where two compulsive nut jobs are going to mainline history means and then compulsively research the nonsense behind it. And then join forces once a week and tell each other the stories we’ve only recently learned. We’re going to hope to help you others never heard it. I’m host one. I mean, I’m host two. And I also mean, I’m Teresa. That is Angie. 

Angie: I’m Angie. I was just going to say, oh, are we not, we’re not saying names. 

Theresa: No, we’re not saying we’re out. Now we are also recording this on TikTok Live. So if you want to hear this in real time and not have to wait to nearly the end of May, then just follow us on TikTok. 

Pay attention to when we say we’re going to schedule to record these suckers. And then participate. Enjoy, see what kind of history stories we’re telling. And we’re going to try our best to be present to each other as well as occasionally look at and see everyone who’s joining and say hello. And hey, respond to comments, requests, and dedication. Yes. 

Angie: And dedication. 

Theresa: And dedication. I love that for us. I will, in meetings, if things are going a bit dry, I’ll be like any requests or questions, comments, requests, dedications. And that usually breaks the ice a little bit. I mean, it’s corporate, right? So you have to kind of play by the rules. Corporate rules. I know. They’re not fun, but they are what they are. 

Angie: You know, but like you might be able to get away to resist with your socks. Yeah. I was listening to one of our older episodes this morning and not because I’m a narcissist. 

Theresa: I mean, no one’s going to stop you. 

Angie: You know, it’s true. They can’t. And you were telling me that one of the things I was talking about reminded you of your grand dad and how he made friends in the military because he wore resistance socks. Yes. And I love that. I love that so much. 

Theresa: It’s those stories that make us who we are, right? 

Angie: I believe the term is lore. Yes. And the lore with that man 

Theresa: gives and gives and gives some more. And then a little more after that. I went first and only last time. So I believe you are on deck to take it away. 

Angie: Oh, oh, I don’t even know what to do with that information. 

Theresa: I think it means you need to have your notes open. They’re open. Start speaking on the subject of whatever you’re choosing to introduce. Okay. Okay. 

Angie: Do you know the story of Toy goes in? Yes. Okay. I suspected that you would. But just like you earlier said, I wear compulsive nut jobs and we need to know everything. So I’ve spent the last, I don’t know, two weeks compulsively learning about medieval Japanese politics. And you’d have to for her. 

It’s insane. So I’m just going to start with my sources and I’m going to get to Tamaway, I promise. But like she was just the icing on this intense cake that I was like, why is this not taught in American schools? Or at least it was not taught in my school. 

Theresa: It’s not taught in American schools because we don’t spend a ton of time learning about samurai from the mid 1800s, particularly female samurai. Well, actually she was in the mid 1800s. She was what, 16? 

Angie: She’s 1180 to 85. 

Theresa: 1180. Okay. I know what her paintings or paintings of her I believe look like. I probably have her mistake with somebody else. But I have an image in my brain and I know exactly. 

Angie: Yeah. So there’s a couple of really famous paintings of her and one that is like probably the best piece of propaganda art that you could imagine. So I’m here for it. So with that said, her story, this is the one I texted you on the other day of like, I know the thing happened, but her source is a saga. So does that count? 

Theresa: You know, as now that you tell me her name, yes, yes, it counts. Carry on. I’m here for all of this. 

Angie: So one of my sources is the tale of the Hiki and Japan’s cultural pivot to the art of war. This is from the Association for Asian Studies. There’s a boatload of subsources that I’m not even going to share because they were just like each source answered one question I developed in my research. But there’s a couple other main sources, women warriors of earlier Japan. This is a really fabulous article written by a woman called Rochelle Naweeke of in 2013, she’s part of the University of Hawaii at Hilo. Her article was fabulous and it covers a ton of female like Japanese history. 

Yeah, okay, which I was super in for it. There’s a JSTOR article called Local Legends of the Genpei War, Reflections of Medieval Japanese History by Barbara L. Aaron. I believe that’s how you pronounce it. 

It’s H-A-R-N-N. Okay, there is Columbia University has an East Asian and Asian article. Like this was more for their art, but it sort of gave a little bit of back history to it. And then another JSTOR article called Onobugesha, the Female Samurai Wars of Fugil Japan. And then my beloved husband came in clutch one more time and he found me the English translation of the Hiki Montogatari, which is the source that her story comes from. Okay. So I have it in Japanese, which by the way, Google Translate does not translate, right? No, it’s an old Japanese. Cool. So the words I read last night, I was like, that’s not what they said. 

I know that’s not what they said. And then just a couple of World History Encyclopedias. Okay, so my story, as I mentioned, is going to take us all the way back to 1180 AD, but it starts before that to help set the scene a bit. 

And honestly, this is where I’ve been obsessed the last couple of weeks. Okay. I think this helps us understand the events and the people better. But also, like I said, like, why isn’t this taught? 

American schools got the chard end of the stick when it comes to world history because this era of world history is phenomenal. So my story starts in the late Han period, which lasts from 794 to roughly 1185, like that’s the time span. It’s relevant to know that leading up to this time was the Nara period, and it had been marked by internal conflicts between aristocratic houses vying for favor and position, much like we see in the Western world, right? 

Right. As well as increasingly excessive influence on governmental policy from these very strong Buddhist sects whose temples are kind of dotted all over the capital. And when I read that, I was like, how can that be a bad thing? I feel like a strong Buddhist influence is probably a good thing. But I guess not all the politics. 

Theresa: I mean, I think I don’t know enough to really speak on this. Like I feel like I’m wading into waters and I’ve got the klaxon in the back of my brain saying, don’t continue. You will show yourself for the more on you are. There’s a reason the Japanese word for barbearing and foreigners the same word. 

Angie: I mean, I’m curious. I would love to know more about it. I’m going to see if there’s a way to find that answer because it seems like that would be good, but in this case, it made things more difficult. So this inspires the ruling emperor, Kamu, to move the capital a couple of times. First, he moves it to Nago, Kayuko, and then to Hianco in the year 794, which is better known today as Kyoto. So the emperor’s hope here is to start afresh and release the capital city from the corruption and the influence of all of these different groups. The new capital, as I mentioned, its name translates roughly to the capital peace and tranquility, which I think is really cool. I’m sure that’s what he was aiming for. 

Theresa: But is it what they all aim for, though? I mean, no one just goes, this is going to be the capital of blood. That’s true. 

Angie: But I think in his case, he was out there manifesting because this literally ushers in the Han period, which lasts until 1185. And this is an era of peace and cultural flourishing. So this time would see the rise of Japanese literature, art, a political structure that would have a long lasting influence on the culture and a decrease in any Chinese influence within their culture. So this is the timeframe when the tales of Genji would be written. I have a copy of that bookshelf. Right. 

Mine is up on that bookshelf, but you can’t see it. You know what? I believe you. We were meant to be together, I think. 

So, which I just think that’s really cool. Like it was fun to make that I had to go and look. I was like, wait, that feels like, it feels like the tale of Genji time. 

Is it like, let’s confirm that. Anyway, so this is like the timeframe when all the things that we know and love from Japanese culture really get their start. Now, of course, the whole time isn’t always rosy, especially for the peasantry and especially those out in the periphery, like away from the capital city. But the majority of Japan’s population works off the land either for themselves or for the estate of others, and they often have to deal with banditry and excessive taxation. So things aren’t perfect, but they’re at least for the most part peaceful. 

Theresa: You know, my brain doesn’t want to say taxes were a thing in the 7,800. Like I get that they are, but I just, that feels so anachronistic. 

Angie: It feels weird. I’m sure it probably went by a different word, right? Like a different name altogether. Ties, like there’s probably a way different word that was used, but there are some rebellions. 

There is a rebellion that is led in Kanto under the leadership of Chiare no Makasato between the years of 935 and 940. Those names are going to come back later. So I included that in my story just to like get your wills turned in that those names matter. And this is also when we see the rise of the samurai. Okay. 

So when I tell you this next bit, just please know that it is in the simplest terms possible because that’s what I had to do for myself. I am sure there is a ton more nuance, but basically the landed wealthy are just getting richer and richer, and they have this ability to buy up more and more land. And while they’re out there sort of building their real estate portfolios, they’re not really residing in those places. They’re staying at their lovely maizons in the capital, and then they’re hiring out staff to run their country of states, this checks, right? And armies to then protect those estates, right? 

Okay. So in fact, like worldhistory.org says, the government system of conscription in Japan was ended in 792. And so in the following period of the Heian period, 794 to 1185, private armies were formed in order to protect the landed interests of nobles who spent most of their time away at the imperial court. This is the beginning of the samurai. And at the time, the name means attendant. Like we weren’t just a military class. We weren’t just a fighting class, right? And I thought that was really, thought that was interesting because, you know, from our standpoint, or at least from my standpoint, you don’t think of them as an attendant. You think of them as a samurai as we know them, right? Like, well, yeah. And I mean, things evolve, right? 

Theresa: You know, and, and words shift in meaning over time. 

Angie: Yeah, they do. And that’s exactly what happened in this case. But as you can imagine, you can kind of see where this is going to go, right? Um, they’re buying up tons of property. They’re buying armies to protect their property. Japan’s not like huge in property to begin with. 

Theresa: No, you think about it. No. Right. 

Angie: So we’ve got all this going. Um, just, just walk this, walk this journey with me. There’s, there’s this really fabulous, um, political system in place in Japan at the time. So, um, it’s called Cloyster Rule. Are you familiar with this? Cause I was not. No. 

Theresa: Oh, you got to understand. I wasn’t there in 700. I was there closer to say, I think my last bout ended in 2008, 2009. Yeah. 

Angie: I mean, you’re there closer to now than you were closer to. Yeah. Yeah. Um, I’m just, I’m asking because I don’t want to like spam you with facts that you already know, but on the same time, like this was really interesting to me. I had no idea. So like I needed to know. 

Um, basically this is how it works. The, the emperor, he would advocate or retire and give the throne up to his chosen successor, but he would still retain like a ton of power and influence. These emperors would often retire to a Buddhist monastery. Kind of hence the withdrawal from society and the name of Cloyster rule. 

Um, and then these emperors worked as sort of a counter counterbalance to the influence of the few, a judge food, you are a regents and the warrior class. Okay. So at the same time as this, we have these. The emperor’s imperial family, right? And they are making babies like crazy. 

And so right around this time or maybe a little before they start kind of shedding the family off into two separate groups. And then you have the Fujiwara. So you have basically these three family names and they’re all tied to the imperial family. 

Okay. So it makes it a very interesting dynamic to say the least. So the Fujiwara, they’re this super powerful family whose men serve as regents to the emperor and the women are married into noble families and the imperial family as well for like generations. So they’re setting themselves up for continual success over and over and over again. 

Generational wealth and power. Excuse me. Yes, absolutely. And then you have like the actual sitting emperor who fulfills all the ceremonial duties and the formal duties of actually running the monarchy, but he’s working within these constraints of the retired emperor, all these regions and these other imperial influences. So he’s got a lot of people. It’s like bureaucracy. And it’s finest, I think. 

Theresa: Bureaucracy is another thing. I just have a hard time conceptualizing and. Yeah, I agree. 

Angie: So this goes on for quite some time. And in the decades before where my story really takes off, sometime around the late fifties, there was an emperor. He’s called Emperor Tova and he tells his son, who was the current sitting emperor, Emperor Sudoku. Hey, like, I think you need to sit all the way down and advocate throne in preference for another one of my sons, who at the time is like a child, like a small child. And Sudoku’s like, OK, pops, and he bows out. He’s like, whatever. 

Theresa: So my dad, are you doing where they’re just like actually give it to the kid? Right. 

Angie: Well, then Emperor Tova makes it worse because he said, OK, you remember how like I made you my successor and then your son was supposed to be your successor. I’m actually changing that too. And Sudoku’s like, cool, I guess. And then, well, Tova goes off and has the good sense to just die. 

Theresa: Like, yeah, I feel like that’s the safest move. Right. 

Angie: And honest to God, my first thought was this feels so House of the Dragon. But you set them up for this failure. You set them up for the next like 300 years and then you just often die. 

Thanks, buddy. At some point, Emperor Sudoku is he kind of comes back and he tries to regain the throne, but he’s defeated. And then he dies in exile. And at this point, it’s like 1164, he becomes one of Japan’s most feared ghosts. 

Ghosts, I think is. So much so that even in like more recent times, emperors have built temples to him to like appease him. Because there is that like he’s that real of a thing and that real of a threat. And I was like, oh, that’s kind of that’s kind of interesting. Okay, I didn’t know you just had like kind of power. Like that’s pretty cool. I mean, yeah, that’s that’s quite a bit of authority. Right. 

Especially a thousand years later to still have emperors building you temples just so that like we can make peace and like have a good run, you know. So. So all that’s happening. And then as you can imagine, all of these events where they create what we call a bit of a battle of succession. 

Theresa: Really? Huh? I wonder why that is. It’s so weird. Like you think they would just sit down and they talk it out. 

Theresa: But I was the first guy. No, but you were removed. But it was your son. But that’s still like he’s I’m reading it. 

Angie: But he’s three. Like, um, so there’s right. So member, I mentioned there, these other families involved that are all members of the Imperial family from one way, one way or another. They’re all descendants. Okay. 

So we have the. Tiara and the Minamoto clans, which in the result or in would result in sort of this, the end of the Imperial rule and the downfall of the Tiara as well as the establishment of the Kamikura Shogunate. Under Minamoto, no, you’re not Tomo, who appoints himself the Shogun in 1192, and he then devours Japan as a military dictator. And I think this is where like we understand Japanese history is like from this point on. Right. 

Theresa: I mean, because I didn’t pick up with no boo or Oda no Vinaga until like, and he was 1550. 

Angie: Right. So same sort of style of government though, right? Yeah. So this all begins like all of these events that are that are happening all come to a head in 1179, falling in a coup by the triare. Ta, I R A I pronounce it different every time. And I know how to say it, but I can’t. I R A. Hold on. Let me write it out in Japanese. It. Taira. Taira. Ah, OK. Taira, thank you. I said it so many times yesterday 

Theresa: and you probably said it a different way each time. I eat. 

Angie: I yelled it a few times. Hi, right. Yes. Taira Banks is how I’m going to remember this. Thank you so much. You’re welcome. I’m here for you. So this coup leads to the removal of all rivals from governmental positions and subsequently banishes them. And this causes a call to arms against the Tyra led by the Minamoto in 1180. 

Theresa: And now that we’ve decided that it’s Tyra Banks, how we’re going to remember it, that’s a crazy visual. You’re welcome. Yeah, carry on. 

Angie: I can’t wait to see an America’s Next Top Model next season. A little bit bloodier than right. Then it had to normal. So I initially wasn’t going to include that that bit about the coup, but I thought how interesting, given the time we live in this removal of rivals from governmental posts and the subsequent banishing of them seems really relevant. Yeah. 

Bring it back to your belt. Right. Now, as I said, it’s also worth stating that all of the parties involved are somehow related. And like, it’s not a family tree. It’s a family bush. And if there’s anybody that actually fully understands the Japanese Imperial family at this time amongst our listeners, can someone draw me a map? 

Theresa: Oh, yeah, I don’t have that knowledge. 

Angie: There’s so many names and the wives are Buujara, Mary Down and through and through. And it’s very like, I’m sorry, you have 17 Johns in your family. 

Theresa: Okay. So I found a new way to pronounce that. And so I got confused. 

Angie: Bujewara. So this is the world that our girl, Tomoe, goes and she’s born into. Now, she is a member. There are two types of female Sam rides. There is the Onobugasha and then there is the Onomusha. 

Theresa: Yeah. Yeah, we discovered that when we did the blood-soaked battle angel episode. Right. 

Angie: So I just, I think that’s so fascinating. And I think my understanding is the Onomusha are the ones that go out and the Buujasha are the ones that stay. So they’re the defense. 

Theresa: I would have to pull out my notes to see, but I know that there was that differentiation. So if you’ve recently looked it up, I’m going to just trust you blindly. 

Angie: I’m going to have to say I think my money is on the Buujasha because if you are trained to be the last line of defense to protect the family and the children, you have to be amazing. Right. No, I think that means you’re actually home. You are home, but you’re staying home to protect the family. Or the family of the, of the Shogun you’re working for, right? Like, it’s either way, it’s their badass across the board, in my opinion. So, um, Tomoe, Tomoe goes in. She is, um, most famous both in her day and today, which I think is pretty cool. Like her fame hasn’t dwindled. 

Theresa: No, it hit a resurgence actually. 

Angie: Yeah, which I think is super cool. Now, they would be, um, the university of Hawaii has this great write up on the different types of classes and what they did. And they go on to tell you that she basically is of the Buujasha. However, some of the other sources suggest she was an Onamusa and it makes me wonder if actually that her mother was one and she was the other. Okay. Because it’s not real clear because she actually did go out on campaigns. Well, and that was in my. Could it be that you shift? 

Theresa: You were this for a certain period of time and then you transition to or maybe I think in her case. 

Angie: So her Lord is General Minamoto Kiso Yoshinaka and she is incredibly loyal to him. So it is possible that he brings her on campaign because he makes her his second. 

There is no one more powerful than her, except him. So I would think maybe there is a chance that they could go from 1 position to the next, depending on the needs. Maybe, but I’m a little unclear on that. I just, I think it’s a really interesting differentiation to begin with. 

Theresa: Anyway, I just remembered where this is going and I got so excited. 

Angie: So the university of Hawaii has a really great quote on her. Lady Tomoe was the servant, lover, and in some reports, a wife of the general. Tomoe’s father was Nakahara Kanto and more significantly, her mother was Minoto. She was Yoshinaka’s wet nurse. It was custom per general. Oh, okay. 

Theresa: So they were all that is fairly incestuous. 

Angie: Right? I’m not sure that they were like directly. I think they were adjacent. I don’t think they were like of the same. 

Theresa: No, but I just mean like to be nursed at the same boob as your lover. Yes. 

Angie: So there’s no, no one seems to fully understand what their relationship is, but it is highly expected that they were lovers in some way. Um, but part of that is because of this. So it’s custom in pre-modern Japan for children of rank to be quote suckled by a Minoto. And this honor is usually bestowed as a reward for service. And both the Minoto and her family would play an essential role in bringing up and educating the child and trusted to them and identifying and caring for the interest completely within the child’s scope. 

So like he is raised with her and he knows that him and his blood siblings are predestined for competition and political scheming. Right? Right. However, not with her. She’s never going to be a problem for him. 

So he bonds with her immediately. And I think that whether they’re lovers or not is irrelevant. They’re definitely very close. They’re definitely raised together. They’re definitely fond of each other. 

Whatever that looks like, unclear. Now they’re educated together. She powers passed on through male inheritance and like literal blood feuding. So it’s likely that the reason for his close relationship with her was that there was no reason to fear betrayal. Like he knew he could count on her. She wasn’t going to be a problem for him. 

Like I just said a minute ago. So he rises her through the ranks makes him makes her the commander of his troops. And then the Hiki describes her. 

I love this so much that they have a description. She has long black hair, a fair complexion. Her face was very lovely. Additionally, it goes on to say that she was a fearless writer who neither the fiercest horse nor the roughest ground could dismay. She was so good with what they called the handle sword. I’m assuming that’s the Naganata. 

Theresa: Handle. I don’t know why they I don’t know. The handle sword. I think it’s just a weird translation issue. No, I would say Naganata is probably not that I would say that’s probably one of because I think she was more in the. I don’t I don’t know. 

Angie: I’m going to I’m going to say the name Naganata. 

Theresa: Did she get it? Okay, carry on. I’m just going to keep my mouth shut and not be wrong. 

Angie: But here’s the thing. You could be totally right because she was trained in multiple weapons. Yeah, so I’m like the hell is a handle sword. What does that mean? Yeah, I was thinking it’s a weird translation because it’s only been translated like five times. So it’s possible that in 1896 with the translation I had, they didn’t have the right words, right? 

Theresa: These white people know what a handle sword is. Just put it in there. 

Angie: I don’t figure it out. White people are smart. 

Theresa: We’re really not. Please, please. Don’t. 

Angie: We’re begging you to help us here. Um, but anyway, she’s also she’s also trained in the bow and it says that she was the match for a thousand warriors and fit to meet either God or devil. 

Theresa: Now, when she’s doing bow, is she doing it on horseback? Yes. 

Angie: Ha, they are questrians and riding for her was second nature. And I did not know that Samurai were originally a question and base at all. I think that’s so like if I knew it totally went out of my brain. 

I think that’s so cool. So she’s basically matchless and her renown. And it’s in the last fight at the battle of Alwazoo, where when all the others are dead or fled her and just six others remain. 

By the end of the battle, her Lord is mortally wounded. And can I just take a second to read from the saga and tell you what he looked that day because he looks he’s a sight to behold. It says quote, the day Kiso was arrayed in a hitari of red brocade and a suit of armor laced with Chinese silk by his side hung a magnificent sword mounted in silver and gold. And his helmet was surmounted with long golden horns of his 24 eagle feathers, eagle feathered arrows. Most had been shot away in the previous fighting and only a few were left drawn out high from the quiver. 

And he grasped his rotten. Mess of sorts every time. Ratten R.A .T.T .A. Retain. Thank you. Retain bound bow by the middle as he set his famous great charger fiercely the devil on a saddle mountain in gold. 

Theresa: That is that is decadent. 

Angie: Oh my gosh, I am picturing him and I’m just thinking I don’t know the actor’s name, but I know exactly who I want to play this role in the movie. So now they have that in your mind. He he’s dying, right? Like he’s been mortally wounded. 

Theresa: Typically there’s no coming back from that. 

Angie: Typically not. Tomoe, she’s going to be having none of this leaving him and they go on to say in the saga that they are now reduced to five survivors. Tomoe still holds her place. He also says to her, as you are a woman, it would it would it were better that you now make your escape. I have made up my mind to die either by the hand of my enemy or by my own. 

And how would Yoshinaka be shamed if his last fight he died with a woman? Yeah, yeah. So she’s like, uh, no, I will not leave you. I’m still full of fight, not a chance. So she replies for some bold warrior to match with that. He also might see how fine a death I can die. She draws aside her horse and she waits and then I’m going to butcher the same. 

I’m so sorry. Odana no. Odna no. Hachario. Mushi of. A strong and valiant samurai comes riding up with 30 of his followers. Tomoe immediately dashes to them, flings herself upon him, grapples with him, drags him from his horse, presses him and I say calmly against the pommel of her saddle and cuts off his head. 

Theresa: That is a lot of moving pieces. I’m trying to imagine how you would calmly deal with a horse, which they have minds of their own. It’s not a tank. Right. 

Angie: How you deal with the 29 other guys in the match. Right. Like, I mean, I have a feeling that it’s like, you know what, fair play to the check. 

Theresa: I’m gonna sit right here. Like, honestly, you know what, if he wanted out of it, he’d get out of it. He wants this. Did you see what he was wearing? 

Angie: So the last thing we hear of her in the saga is that she strips off her armor and she flees away to the Eastern provinces. Now, the really frustrating part is we don’t know what actually happens to her after the battle, but I do have some ideas. 

Okay. The chronicles, they also extend into the version of the Gem paid Josaki, which is gives different adversaries to her and tells a little bit of a different story that I did not. I don’t have a copy of so it’s a little bit harder to see what’s different and what’s not. But the university of Hawaii talks about some of the things suggesting that she was actually attacked by a pine tree trunk that was made to be like a club. 

Theresa: I make more sense. Somebody wielding a pine tree trunk, not that she… 

Angie: I think that he jumped out of the ground and just came after her. Yeah. No. It’s possible that the man that did that to her made her his concubine. There are other reports that one of the other samurai leaders took her as his wife in hopes of producing strong warrior sons. That’s not consensual. Right. There’s like whole stories based around that. There is another account that says despite her gender she was destined for beheading because of her part in the battles. Yeah. Yeah. That checks as well. 

Right. Another story that people really love, and this may be the truth. It kind of makes sense, but it also really doesn’t when you think about her life, is that she goes into hiding at a monastery, becomes a nun, and dies around 90. I’m not so sure I buy that. Like I don’t feel like you would just opt out in that way with the life you’ve lived, but maybe? 

Theresa: Yeah. I don’t know. I mean, honestly, retirement sounds great after seeing all of that, I’m sure. 

Angie: I think for me I would want the peace, but also you’re kind of going to live the rest of your life wondering who’s behind you. Now another account says that she goes on a revenge mission. She kills all of her master’s enemy before walking into the sea holding one of their heads so that no one could desecrate it. You take whatever ending you want. There’s a lot to play with. 

I took the 90-year-old going on a killing spree and walking into the ocean with her enemy’s head. That was my option. May we all be so lucky. Exactly. Now, the end of the again, pay war marks the beginning of the Shogunate and the rise of the power of the warrior class. But what I think is really interesting about that, all of this is that the colors of the Tyra and the Minamoto standards are especially Japan’s national colors today. 

Yeah, that makes sense. I think this is really, really cool. So yeah, I think that’s my story of Tomoe Gozen and the House of Dragons level BS that Emperor Tobu pulled before he decided to opt out. 

Theresa: You know, and this is just one of those things, like a clear, clean succession plan solves a lot of angst. 

Angie: Put it in writing, people. 

Theresa: Get everyone to agree before, you know, before you opt out. 

Angie: Yeah, that’s all it takes. It would be so easy. Otherwise, you get episodes of Game of Thrones and entire awards about it. Yeah. Yeah. I love that. 

Theresa: I love that at all. I love that at all. I love that a lot. 

Angie: You love that at all. 

Theresa: I love that at all. Um, all right. Well, I guess that means I have to tell you a story now. Yeah, we can. I’m going to tell you about I’m going to take a wild departure. Are you ready for this? So we went to Medieval Japan, feudal Japan. We’re going to Portland, Oregon. And I’m going to tell you the story of the Lone Fur Cemetery. 

Angie: Fur like trees? As in fur like, okay. My sources. I’m glad I started with that. 

Theresa: Yeah. As opposed to being like, have a muckrat, make it into this. 

Theresa: Beaver pal, what are we playing with? Okay. My sources, Oregon History Project. 

Theresa: Oregon History Project. They had an article on the passage of the Chinese bill, the Oregon Cyclopedia. There’s an essay there called Chinese Americans in Oregon by Douglas Lee. Great. And then there’s a couple articles on Oregon Metro. Also a couple of podcasts I listened to. PNW, haunts and homicides rooted in history, unearthing, Lone Fur Cemetery’s haunting past and think out loud honoring Chinese immigrants buried in Portland’s Lone Fur Cemetery. 

Angie: Can you say Lone Fur Cemetery one more time? 

Theresa: Oh, you’re going to hear it like a dozen more times. You’re up. Like I just pretty much copy pasted that. Okay. So we have a small group of Cantonese Chinese miners who arrive in the Oregon territory in 1858 to 1853. 

Now, they came in through from China via California up to the Oregon territory. Okay. And I was just like, oh, that makes sense. It just, I didn’t, like those are things that make sense in hindsight and you have like go through and follow the rabbit crumbs. 

Angie: The rabbit crumbs, the bread crumbs, the rabbit crumbs. I like rabbit crumbs and bread trails. 

Theresa: Bread trails makes it sound like I’m on my way to a bakery. Like I am going to follow the bread trail. 

Angie: Look, a good French loaf that’s fluffy on the inside. 

Theresa: I’m a glute heart. I haven’t had a good French loaf since I was diagnosed. 

Angie: I will go eat one for you. 

Theresa: Thank you. Just talk to me about its mouthfeel and its open crumb. That’s those are things that are foreign to me. My bread looks like sadness. 

Angie: So, so it was me with cheese last week. 

Theresa: Yeah, yeah, like we’ll get hamburgers and hubs will be like, is this my burger? I was like, no, that bun doesn’t look like depression. That one’s mine. That your bun’s happy. Thank you. Yeah. Yeah. My bun’s begging to be put back in the freezer. Please. 

Okay. So back back to Chinese immigrants in the Oregon territory. This is the 1850s. And so we have a very finite level of jobs. Primarily we’re seeing miners of gold and silver. And then there’s like a handful of merchants who come in and they are going throughout Oregon territory. 

Okay. Now, what we see is like the heyday of Chinese immigration into Oregon is going to be from 1860 to 1885. And this is going to be around the time when the American West opens up. There’s a ton of economic opportunity. And we have this increasing number of Chinese people. And they’re all coming from basically one region in China via California. This is going to say. If you see what I mean, you hear it, you’re like, huh, via California makes sense. 

Angie: But to come from one region in China is really like you think it would be more widespread. 

Theresa: Well, I mean, I think it’s a lot of those like, oh, I’m going to go to, I mean, the colonies for lack of better words. I don’t know how they viewed America. I know they weren’t thinking of it as that. And I’m going to go find. Fortune success. Right. 

Angie: Like everybody else did during the gold rush. 

Theresa: No, yeah. Now, as all this is going on, we have a really not cool anti-Chinese movement that’s occurring in the American West. I know, right? I mean, this is one of those things that we kind of talked on when I talked about the Shanghai tunnels in Portland. Mm hmm. And I think you touched on it when, you know, you kind of, I think it was Madame mustache might have included a hint of that as well. 

Angie: Yeah, I think she, she had dealt with some sex workers, I think, if I remember right, that fell within that category of how do we manage safety and things like that? Yeah. If I remember right. 

Theresa: I mean, and I’m just going to take your word for it. Cause that’s, that was a while ago that we covered her. 

Angie: Um, I was just thinking about her the other day going, I know I did her story. 

Theresa: I mean, and these are the things like we’ve covered hundreds of stories by now. And we’re trying to hold all of them in our brain simultaneously. There’s, there’s just, we’re going to, we’re going to let plates fall. Um, yeah, that’s fair. In 1860, we have 22 Chinese people in the Oregon territory or in Portland. 

Angie: 1860. In 1860. Oh, okay. Just in Portland. Okay. 

Theresa: Got it. Um, by 1880, there’s almost 2,500. Okay. So things have accelerated. There are more Chinese people here. Um, the, we actually, Portland boasted the largest Chinese community that existed between San Francisco and Vancouver, BC. Wow. Okay. Which I, my mind was blown by that fact alone. Yeah. That is pretty wild. 

Angie: Well, that’s like a lot of space to cover too. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Okay. 

Theresa: Especially knowing that Portland now is the whitest city in the U S. And I’m just like, where did you guys all go? Now, um, East, they went East, I think, anywhere else, truly, because things are, are a bit rough in Portland, right? 

Um, we have this huge group of them and this is just like the whole confluence of all of these things coming. So we have in the, in the half century between 1855 and 1940, we have the, um, Cantonese, Chinese Portland population is more, it’s organized pretty close to the Cantonese San Francisco or any other major Chinese communities in North America. So China town, the whole nine, right? And this is why we have a lot of those established China towns in these big metropolitan areas. Merchants would come in, they’d help establish the social organizations that came in and then they’d start to exercise political control over the community, civic and social life, kind of give it form and structure. Okay. 

Probably what they had back home. I’m, I’m editorializing there. That’s not in my notes. 

Um, and they did so by monopolizing the leadership of key organization. So I think your lineage, your clan, any family associations, she’s got a commonly shared surname, same, same, you’re one of us now. And then we also have these Lukun or commonly known as district associations or native place organizations. And this is where you have kind of these memberships around like more of a physical location back home. So region, you’re from California. So you’re California and you’re from Washington, you’re Washingtonian. 

Angie: You’re like an expat society. 

Theresa: Like, yeah, where you’re from. Yeah. Okay. That means. Yeah. 

Theresa: And then there’s also like another way to organize and like groups or professional guilds or professional groups. And then they also have like secret societies, which I’m all for. Anytime I can get a hold of a secret society and then for it. And then they also had these like fighting tongs. And then you also had it separated between the Christians and what they called community independence. Now, so this is an incredibly complex social hierarchy. Everything here is just incredibly rich and everything. 

There’s this whole, like everyone is really like working together in this community. They’re creating loans. They’re providing social service benefits. They’re doing their own medical. They’re providing legal help. Like they are working together for each other. I love that. Which is beautiful. 

Angie: I wish we could do that better. Like, like today. 

Theresa: Yeah. Well, and I mean, it’s, it also needs to be so that they were doing it in a society that didn’t want them and wouldn’t service or help them. So I think. Right. It kind of enforced that self-reliance or interdependency as a community. 

That makes sense. Now it also, Portland’s Chinese community, it had its own local tensions, but there’s also some great conflicts are spilling over from San Francisco or maybe even Vancouver, BC. And I’ve saved BC because there is a Vancouver just over the water. 

Right next to Portland. Now this. I hate it when that happens. There’s a lot happening. 

Okay. Now we also have this thing that happens from 1870 to 1885. This is where we have a lot, a huge amount of this anti-Chinese movement that takes place and it’s happening all over the country. 

What we’re seeing here though is, and I’m sure it happens elsewhere. We have a couple of things. One, we have the Page Act in 1878. Now this banned immigration of Chinese women of quote, immoral character. 

Angie: So how do you determine that? Good. 

Theresa: You ask who could be a sex worker or not, because there’s so many discriminatory federal policies in place that they basically just ban all women unless or all women are presumed immoral. Until they can be proven otherwise. How do you prove it then? Basically, you just turn away all women at the door. And so you have this happening and then you have just a lot of discrimination against the Chinese men in the city. They’re relegated to low paying jobs. And then you have tensions that are building because whites and the Europeans, they’re upset that they cannot get, there’s competition for these low paying jobs. And they know that it’s those Chinese people that are accepting those low wages so that even if I wanted that job, I would get paid less than I should be paid for that work. It’s like, I’m pretty sure the Chinese are not the ones setting the wages that they’re the taking. Like they’re taking what’s off. Like they’re not saying, no, no, no, put half of that back in the pocket. 

Angie: Go, do all of me take a quarter? That’s fine. Yeah. 

Theresa: I don’t, I don’t need all of that. Come on. I’m not trying to, to break the bank. 

Angie: Said with a transatlantic accent because that only makes sense. 

Theresa: Of course. Now, on top of all of this in 1885, we have 500 Chinese that are kicked out of Tacoma, Washington, and they’re sent by train to Portland further adding on to these tensions. Okay. Now, as all this is going on, like I should say a couple years before that in 1882, we have the Chinese Exclusion Act. Are you familiar with this? Bigly, yes. Okay. So that’s where the US. 

Angie: It’s been a minute. But yeah, they kick out or they ban all Chinese laborers for 10 years. 

Theresa: Basically, they’re saying they ban all Chinese, you know, even though technically merchants, diplomats, professional students are exempt. It’s kind of difficult, much like it is to say prove you’re not a sex worker. Yeah. Yeah. On top of that, we have in 1892 with the Geary Act, which renewed this Chinese exclusion for another 10 years and required every Chinese person to carry photo identification. Yeah. And then 1902, we decided this is so good, we’re going to make it permanent and it doesn’t get repealed till 43. 

Angie: It’s wild that even got repealed in 43, if we’re honest, you would think it would have been later than that. You know, you think about it like 

Theresa: that was repealed just the year before Helen Duncan was tried for the 1734 Witchcraft Act in Britain. Mm-hmm. Both of those are wild and well overstayed. 

Angie: Yeah. A little bit, just a little bit, just by a few years. 

Theresa: So all of this is happening. Like there’s just a ton of really, really awful things that I absolutely hate. We also have this great thing where, I mean, we’re not giving them citizenship. We’re not allowing, even if they are here. 

You know, it’s like we don’t allow naturalization because that’s limited to white immigrants and of course Chinese are discriminated against in housing. They’re banned from public schools. They can’t enter certain professions. They can’t serve on juries, which I’m more or less for or against. 

I mean, depending on the jury, right? Like I want to be on a good one. I don’t want to be on a lame one. I don’t want to hear about the old woman who screamed at children. 

Yeah. I’m not a fan of jury duty. Give me some juicy ones. I’m here for the tea. 

I’m not here for anything lame. Please don’t let me know the person. I mean, I think they screen you for that. I think you’re really desperate to take you if you say I know that human. 

Angie: That’s true. I’ve only had to actually attend jury duty three times. That’s quite a bit. Well, I only had to sit on one jury. The other two were just one was dismissed and one I wouldn’t have been able to settle in anyway. Oh, so that right? 

Theresa: Now, I should also say, and this probably go without without mention that the Chinese are not also allowed to hold office. 

Angie: Or I assume we can’t be naturalized if you can’t hold off. 

Theresa: Well, but if you’re born and like you can’t be naturalized, but if you have a child, they can have birthright citizenship. 

Angie: No, that’s okay. So I didn’t think that was an option. Okay, that’s cool. Great. But you can’t hold off as a one good thing we put in here. 

Theresa: Yeah. Yeah, I’ll have to cover that. I might cover that next week. Um, okay. I kind of told these out of order, but so as all of this is happening. Okay. 

Now, so I’ve all of this is just background. We have to think about when these people, because they’re coming, they’re building the railroads, they’re digging the mines, they’re doing all the backbreaking labor. When they die, we’re continuing that discrimination because we’re relegating them to the Southwest corner of the loan for cemetery. And this is known as the old Chinese burial ground, basically. And in the think outlaws podcast, the Chinese residents that work together would work as a community to make sure they were buried next to each other in this corner. And it’s referred to as block 14. And then according to kind of custom, they’re buried there pretty much only for a short time. 

And then they’re dug up by a specialist and placed in lead boxes, properly labeled and sent back to the homeland to be put in the ancestral tombs. Oh, wow. Okay. So they’re really interesting. They’re reunited with their ancestors. But, you know, I’m assuming you’re only there for a short time because we haven’t really ironed out how to transport bodies in the 1800s in nine ways. We’re still working on it. 

So you had to kind of get creative with it a little bit. So it’s the Chinese who built Portland and they’re the denizens of block 14. Now, there’s also a naughty little rumor that the Oregon Hospital for the Insane, it opened in 1862. And this is under a guy named James C. Hawthorne and Dr. Hawthorne. And if you know Portland, Hawthorne is like a neighborhood. 

It is like, you know, you know exactly this. Well, on that street where Hawthorne is used to be this insane asylum. Well, he promised a decent burial to any of his patients who died in their care if they’d been abandoned by their families. Over the time that the hospital was open and it wasn’t open for terribly long, 132 people died and were buried at Lone Fur. 

Rumored to also be in block 14. Okay. So whether you were okay is just turning into kind of like the place where they put people. We don’t want to think about that. 

That ended up being dispelled and I can kind of go into that in a little bit. So if I don’t remind me, because my notes are all over the place, because I went down a dozen rabbit holes. Now, same as all this goes on, the cemetery falls into disrepair. Blackberries overrun the entire cemetery, the wooden grave markers, they begin to rot away and the old headstones crack, crumble. 

And they just everything kind of like goes into disrepair. As all this is happening, Multnomah County kind of looks at this corner of the cemetery and goes, well, if that’s not used, we’re just going to put a maintenance yard for the highway department there. And then, of course, 1948, they excavate the block with a bulldozer and they’re like, huh, there’s some bodies here. So they pack those off and those go to China. And then they put, they flap a building there shortly after. 

Angie: Did we, I don’t even know if we have the ability to find the answer to this question, but did we get them back to their proper family tombs in China? Or did we just send them to China with like a return to sender? 

Theresa: I mean, proper feels like something I can’t prove or disprove. 

Angie: I feel like we just shipped them back to China and like, and somebody opened the box and went, oh, God, yeah, what happened here? 

Theresa: And there’s a note attached. I feel like that’s what happened. 

Theresa: And it sat in the post office for the next 17 years. Is everyone just like, I don’t know what to do. Yeah. 

Angie: That’s a, that’s a tomorrow problem. 

Theresa: Yeah. That’s, I don’t get paid enough for this problem. Yeah. So that happened. And then so fast forward to January 20, 2004. We’re alive. Yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah. Okay. Multnomah County, they’re like, you know what, we have the surplus property. We’re not really using it. We could sell it and it could become high rises, condos, business on the first floor. 

And that’s when the friends of the loan first cemetery, they notify community members and they put a pack, a hearing room with 150 people. Good. And they start the conversation with, actually. And I think, yeah, we have pictures. 

We need to review this. And then over the next six months, they start gathering information that indicated that there might be intact burial mounds beneath the excess, the asphalt still. 

Angie: Why did I know that’s what you were going to say? As soon as you said, and then they slapped a building on there, I was like, we didn’t look further, did we? 

Theresa: We looked good enough. We hit the good enough button and put a building there. Okay. And then there’s records at the Oregon Historical Society and the Chinese Consolidated Benevolent Association that showed that not all the Chinese that were buried there returned to China. And there were probably, probably some that had been left when the excavation happened in 48. Now County Commissioner Maria Rojote Steffi, she decides to try and do the right thing. So she commissions an archaeological investigation. They do the full thing. They do ground print training radar. And they note several anomalies. Several anomalies. Thank you. I couldn’t do it. I cried my best. 

Angie: Listen, there were some words I couldn’t pronounce today either, and we’re here for each other. Anomalies weird enough is the word I can actually say. 

Theresa: I don’t know why that word left me. 

Angie: So the River Times, that’s all I’ll say. 

Theresa: Fair. January 2005, they get archaeologists out there and they find two intact burials. Okay. And so they’re like, yeah, we’re not done here yet. And it’s at this point that they have to reclassify the land back as a cemetery and historical landmark so they can’t sell it for commercial development. Good. And the county recognizes its civil duty and removed the building and repatriated it back to Lone For Cemetery. Good. 

Angie: Now, I’m so mad that we put the building there in the first place. 

Theresa: Like, I mean, it took us two years to remove it because that was 2005, we found the mounds. And then 2007, the building’s removed. And then the ground is leveled and returned to grass. Now, bureaucracy. These things take time. These things take time. 

Yes. The county and the city, they work together to complete this project. They gave the deed back to, or over to Metro, which kind of manages the rest of the cemetery. And then in 2011, they start, the Cemetery Foundation starts raising funds for the creation of what they called a cultural heritage garden to honor the Chinese workers and asylum patients that are buried in 14. 

And then in, because right now it’s just a barren field. 2019, the voters approved a park and nature bond. And so Metro earmarked like $4 million for the creation of this. Like that would go into doing additional research, doing further due diligence, creating the structure, allocating funds for Chinese people to do art and have art there, you know, to really try to like lean into it. Now, Kitto and I explored the cemetery recently and we looked for block 14. 

And we’re going through, we’re going through, we’re going through. It is literally a barren field in the middle of Portland surrounded, the beautiful, Gothic mausoleum, crazy ornate old headstones. And then the occasional like weird recent headstone with a laser engraving and a face looking back at you. 

It is the most mind boggling inner mixture juxtaposition of things you can see. And then there’s just this barren field like this chain length or not little chain at hip height. And then a couple of signs that say this, this looks like a barren field, but it’s, it’s not what you think. And so they look to do or they’re going to build a memorial there. But one of the things they want to do is they want to make sure that they don’t build over grave sites there. 

And they also want to do something that kind of leads in and honors who’s there. So in the process of doing this full investigation, they found out that the asylum patients were not there. They’re buried over in block 10. There was kind of typo rumors, what have you. And that the space really was primarily Chinese workers and immigrants who were there. And they have this whole space that’s going to have like space with the names of the people who had been entered there, whether they’re still there or not. And a symbolic space that’ll be where they had a stone altar where people would leave offerings where mourners would. And I have kind of the only real image that we have of that site. Of what it looked like before we put a parking lot there. 

Angie: Okay. So it’s a seabed tone photo. It’s definitely a cemetery. I’m unclear on what that in the top center, just to the left of the tree is. What is that right there? I know just above that the. 

Theresa: Oh, this right here. I think this is the stone altar where they have probably like sticks of incense and things like that. 

Angie: So they’re going to have that makes sense. What’s the thing on the left of the that the taller thing, this here or that? Nope, that’s that. 

Theresa: There you might let go. I know what that is. Okay, you know. But so since they earmarked those funds, started doing all the research, they did a ton of work with the community with setting things up, getting the contractors done. They plan on breaking ground on that monument this year and finishing this year. That’s awesome. So I love that. Fingers crossed they get that done. My last update that I had for that was like from January. 

Angie: So I think it’s cool that there are people that are willing to do the work to make make right the mistakes that were committed in the past. In this and I’ll be curious to know like my heart also goes out to those that were buried in block 10. That are sort of unknown because oftentimes people that are find themselves in these asylums are so looked over members of society, regardless of race or gender or whatever. 

And they’re not often memorialized in any way. So it’s it’s it’s nice to see that at least in this case, the Chinese are getting some sort of I don’t know, recompense isn’t the right word, but they’re trying to rectify the mistakes of the past in a beautiful way. It sounds like it’s going to be funny. 

Theresa: Yeah, I mean, and I don’t have images of what it’ll be, but it sounds like they’re going to make nameplates for every person who had been interred there and then they’re going to have them displayed ornately. So that’s cool. My hope that is that what this but I do think there’s something beautiful about how even now in this super derisive time in the whitest city in the country, we are trying to honor people who don’t look like the dominant culture. 

Mm hmm. And if we can do it here, there could be healing found anywhere and everywhere. It’s going to take a concerted effort and all of us coming together and be like, you know, maybe, maybe no, maybe no, maybe we fix it. 

Angie: Maybe we, I don’t know, apologize for the actions of our ancestors and do our best to be better people today because at the end of the day, you can’t fix what’s already been done, but you can fix the future. You know? Yeah. Yeah. 

Theresa: But that’s the story of the loan for cemetery. 

Angie: Can I also just say for the record, I love that Kido gets to grow up going to cemeteries with you and she’s going to get to say like two truths and a lie later. Oh yeah, me and my mom used to cemetery up all the time. 

Theresa: Well, and like the crazy thing about loan for cemetery is they have a ghost brush on the outside of the cemetery gates. Like, like you go on certain hikes and they want to keep the hike pristine. They don’t want you to bring in seeds. So they have a brush where you can brush the graveyard off your shoes so you don’t bring home any unwanted visitors. 

But I think like I intentionally didn’t do it when we left the Chinese cemetery because I’m like, you know what? If these guys want to go to a right home, they deserve, you know, a good home cooked meal as wide as I’ll make it. 

Angie: And, you know, you can haunt my cupboards 

Theresa: and be your conversation and, you know, me just saying you’re welcome. Not you’re you’re welcome. You know, you are physically welcome in this place. 

Theresa: I will. Yeah, you know, I knew what you meant. That’s good. 

Theresa: So I was like, that’s not how I wanted it to come out. So I’m glad you translated. 

Angie: Yeah, you are. You are welcome in my home. Yeah, I think. Yeah, unlike my emperor, who has to have shrines built in so that like peace and prosperity might be an option, which I think is cool that that’s even a thing that like you can just go off and become a ghost. Like, I’ve decided I’ve been wrong. So I’m going to haunt every descendant from here into eternity. 

Theresa: I’ve heard of someone whose final words are I haunt you with my dying breath. And my problem is I would try to say that and then I’d be alive for another two days. I’m like, crap. 

Angie: No, you know what? At that point, you just cease talking. But yeah, you know what? I’m in. I commit to the bit. Yeah. Yes. 

Theresa: Well, you’re also committing to the bit and you’re thinking, what are these ladies going to do next week? Right. Review, subscribe, join us, hang out with us. You can send us story ideas. And by us, I mean me and that’s at unhanded history pod at gmail.com. And on that note, goodbye. 

Theresa: Bye.