Listen to the episode here.

Few white dudes of history have ever earn so much respect from the Black community does, and for good reason.

This week, Theresa takes over the entire episode and shares the unhinged life of John Brown. Starting with his early years, raised in a home that was both steeped in religion and abolitionism, John Brown’s path led him to campaign to end slavery.

During his life, he would earn the respect of Fredrick Douglass, as he polarized the nation in their stances on ending the practice of slavery. Theresa continues to share how it was Brown’s post-conviction writing that furthered his cause, and not so much the raid at Harper’s Ferry.

This is a solid episode, if we say so.

This episode pairs well with:
The attack on Senator Charles Sumner
The Black Panther Party’s Free Breakfast Program

Transcript

Theresa: Hi, and welcome to the Unhinged History Podcast, the podcast where two people are going to compulsively learn the stories that we just got little passing glimpses of on a TikTok, on a YouTube video, on a random picture we saw on Pinterest that hinted at a larger narrative. And then we joined forces once a week and tell our friend the story we’ve only recently learned. I’m host one, I’m Teresa, Nat. Hi, Angie. 

Angie: You know what one of my forces is, like, pretty regularly? Yes. The old guy my husband works with. 

Theresa: Oh, okay, yes, okay. 

Angie: I love that. He’s like, oh, has she talked to you about this? And then Ian has to Google it and bring it home. And he has yet to bring said co-worker home. 

Theresa: Devastated. Maybe a blessing. Maybe this is the font of information that does not play well with others. You know, you should meet your heroes kind of deal. Okay, that’s fair. I’ll let you have that one. Fair. 

Okay, so full transparency. Technically, it’s a you go first day. I, my, my story is it ends on a note. It doesn’t end on necessarily a bad note, but it doesn’t end on like a, oh my God, 

Angie: Teresa, you did not tell a great not talk joke when you’re done. 

Theresa: Okay, so that said, I could go. I’ve ended on worse notes. 

Angie: Just go and we’ll see what happens. Okay. All right. 

Theresa: In which case, I’m going to tell you the story of John Brown. The abolitionist John Brown. The abolitionist John Brown, which crazy enough you say that, that was my main source. 

The book, John Brown abolitionist by David S Reynolds. Awesome. Okay, go. 

Okay. My other sources, archives prologue magazine, a look back at John Brown, spring 2011 volume 43, number one by Paul Finkelman. And then PBS had a, I know it’s, there’s a budget. 

There’s, there’s one real fun name you’re going to enjoy here. PBS online also had an article about John Brown. So here we go. It is 1880. We’re in Torrington, Connecticut, and John Brown is born to a very religious family. And I mean, okay, so when I say very religious, John Brown grows up steeped in religion to the point where he is regularly going to be called an Oliver Cromwell. 

Right. America’s fun governor. But okay, like every time, every time you and I have mentioned Oliver Cromwell in the past, there’s a certain level of disdain. When they mention and relate him back to Oliver Cromwell, there is a certain gravitas to it. Yeah. 

Angie: It’s not that it’s not yeah, we want to be like Oliver Cromwell in our Puritan values. 

Theresa: Like this man walks the walk has very deeply held beliefs. And so that’s, that that is the level of intensity that is John Brown. Okay. Now, the family is led by his father, his father vehemently opposed the slavery. And then when, as you should, which wasn’t common or common enough, when he’s around five years old, the whole family moves to Northern Ohio. And they move to a district that’s really known for these anti slavery views. And John Brown’s dad, Daddy Brown is a prominent businessman. 

Dude has a very large successful tannery. He’s involved in trying to make the Western Reserve College into this anti slavery stronghold. Okay, which I’m not sure exactly what that means or what that, but I have an idea and inkling that this would just be a bastion of views that that’s sort of how I’m taking it. Right. 

But it’s not like I got a ton of details. Now, apparently that falls to the wayside and Daddy Brown supports the creation of Oberlin College, which is racially integrated. Wow. 

Okay. And it is an institution of higher learning that because it’s racially integrated and Daddy Brown has a hand has an anti slavery bed. Now, this all makes sense. Yeah, the building blocks are strong and secure here. Okay, well, Legos are clicked. 

Okay. So despite Papa Brown’s association with colleges and higher ed, Brown himself has very little formal education. Papa Brown, Papa Brown educated. 

Oh, our boy, Johnny Brown, as he’s probably a Johnny and not a John, not not educated, not well. Okay. Okay. Not what I expected. 

Definitely same. But here we go. Now, early in his life, again, religious bend, he’s really gunning to become a clergyman. He ends up even returning to Connecticut to attend a preparatory school. And this is going to be like his four way into seminary. 

Okay. And he ends up kind of it that goes by the wayside because he flunks out of school. Oh, geez. 

These are things, right? I mean, again, it’s the early 1800s, public school is not really, you know, established, he doesn’t have a formal education himself. So he just doesn’t have the building blocks. Now, he’s around age 20, when he gets married, and becomes a foreman at his dad’s tannery. And he forgot dad has a tannery, dad has a tannery. Okay. 

His wife is a woman named Deant Lusk, and she would give birth to seven kiddos. Okay, go down. Go. Yep. Now, by 1918, 1825, Brown moves to Western Pennsylvania, and he sets himself up as a successful tanner, and he is a postmaster. Okay. And coincidentally, he’s working under President John Quincy Adams. Okay. Now, the craziness is that he follows his dad’s footsteps in sort of a weird way, because despite his poor education, and his struggles with schooling, he starts a local school, or helps started at least. That’s cool. 

Angie: So he recognizes that like education is important. 

Theresa: Yeah, and tries to do what he can to further the goal. And then he hits a rough spot because in 1832, his wife dies. But no worries, because 1833, he marries Mary Ann Day. Okay. Now, Mary Ann is uneducated, and 16 years old, literally half his age. He bet. Yeah, but she would go on to have 13 children. 

Angie: Whoa. Only thing. Go ahead. Okay. That would be my question. How many of them survive? Yeah, six would survive to adulthood. 

Theresa: Okay. So he ends up with a baby of 20 children. That’s many children. That’s many children, which would explain why he gets married so quickly. Yeah, he needs some support in the house because the kids outnumber him, and they’re starting to realize it. Immutiny. Yes. Now, okay, I want to place this in the context of some of the other stories I’ve been telling. 

It’s in 1837 that Elijah Parris Lovejoy is killed for defending his printing press. Right? Okay. So, and this was just a recent story I told literally last week. So now you can kind of see how things are happening and falling into place where he was anti-slavery, then this happens. For those playing at home who hadn’t listened to last week’s episode, Elijah Parris Lovejoy had his own paper and was writing about being extremely anti-slavery, and that got people up in their fields. And he died defending a printing press. 

So he died for the fruit of his speech. So moving right along, it’s during these first 50 years of Brown’s life that Brown is going all about the country. You know, we talked about him going from Ohio to Pennsylvania. He later goes to Massachusetts, then to New York, and his family is just ever expanding with more mouths to feed. 

Okay. He’s working a ton of jobs. Like, our boy is pivoting like you wouldn’t believe. He’s a farmer from time to time. He’s a wool merchant, a tanner, a land speculator. 

Okay. Because we got mouths to feed. We got mouths to feed, and he’s just going to do it. Now, despite the number of pivots our boy has, he’s never financially successful. And he’s going to eventually file for bankruptcy when he’s in his 40s. Okay. 

And he’s got 20 kids. Yeah. Yeah. Now, the book goes into huge, great detail about how our man is a boss in the sheep industry. You want to grow your flock? He can do it. You want to produce quality wool, he can do it. You want to be able to grade wool, he can do it. Like, at one point, people testing him, send him a thing, a dog fur that’s been teased up to look like wool and says, what kind of grade would you give this wool? And he’s like, none because it’s not wool. This is dog hair. And they’re like, Oh, dang, you know, okay. But despite all of his great skills, our man is garbage at running a business. Right. 

Angie: Right. We have the skill. We don’t have the admin. Yes. 

Theresa: So if he had only partnered with somebody to compliment where he lacked, I think he’d have been a force, but he is not. Now it’s 1844. Brown, he’s back in the business world. He’s raising sheep. 

Angie: So this is where I think he’s born in 1880. He’s born 1800. 

Theresa: 1800. 1800. Okay. 

Angie: I totally heard you wrong. Okay. I heard 1880. 

Theresa: When you that would have been really weird when I was saying things like 1833 broke, gets married 1834 broke, or wife died. 

Angie: And I was confused. Okay. All right. Well, hey, glad we could clear that up. 

Theresa: Now he 1844, he’s raising sheep. He’s got a business partner and Akron who’s hopefully going to accommodate some of his lack. But this is where that big issue happens because he ends up trying to sell 200,000 pounds of wool in England. Now England is an exporter of wool and he’s trying to sell wool to them, right? 

Angie: I feel like he should have thought that one through a little harder. 

Theresa: I mean, okay, now I’m truncating a story that was pages and pages long into a paragraph. So you’re missing quite a bit because this isn’t the true story. This is just a setup for story. 

Okay. Now, despite all this, he gets creditors who are suing him for their money back. Even though this is happening, nobody accuses him of dishonesty or lacking integrity. Like, okay, even those he owes money to who were almost ruined by his behavior, they all like him. Because he’d be doing it the right way. 

Angie: He’s not smart. 

Theresa: Like you look really like you know what, bro, this sucked. I’m losing everything. Anyway, coming over for dinner on Sunday? Yeah, well, we’d love to see you. They haven’t repot the couch yet. But so that’s happened. 

Okay. So despite our bro being poorer than a church mouse, this doesn’t keep him from supporting the causes he believes in. He would go on to help finance the publication of David Walker’s appeal and Henry Highland’s call to revolution speech or call to rebellion speech, I should say, I should say it right. He’s going on. He’s getting land to fugitive slaves. Okay. 

And then at one point that I’m going to get to, hopefully, I think I’ve mentioned in my notes, he ends up taking in a black child into his own household to raise as his own. Okay. 

Angie: Because you know what, what’s one more mouth? 

Theresa: Yeah, look, we’re already stretched thin. Yeah, we got a little bit more water to the turnips do. Now he would go on to participate in the Underground Railroad. And then in 1851, he helps establish a group called the League of Gileadites. 

And this is an organization that would protect escaped slaves from slave catchers. Love this. Love this. Yep. So our man’s walk in the walk. It’s in 1847 that he meets Frederick Douglass for the first time in Massachusetts. 

Super love this. Douglass would say that quote, though a white gentleman, brown is in sympathy, a black man, and as deeply interested in our cause as though his own soul had been pierced by the iron of slavery. 

Angie: That’s some, some big words for, okay, yeah, he’s invited to the cookout. 

Theresa: That man is not only invited to the cookout, that man is told to bring the mac and cheese. Okay, you got it. Now it’s during this meeting that brown has with Douglass that brown starts to tell him that he would love to lead a war that would free slaves because he views blood out as the only way to really get this. 

Angie: Well, it hasn’t worked so far. So why not try that? 

Theresa: Right? Yeah, like we’ve been peaceful. We’ve had a couple of smaller bellens, but we could probably amp it up a bit and really kick things off and get things going, which probably is what gets Frederick Douglass to be like, I’m him. Now it’s around this or 1849 that brown moves to a black community in North Elba, New York. The community was established because there was a man who, you know, was taking an active philanthropy named Garrett Smith. Garrett would donate 50 or at least 50 acre tracks to black families if they’re willing to clear and farm the land. That’s awesome. 

Okay. Yeah, like they’re trying to do things. Now, brown, he knows that many of the families in the area are having trouble in this isolated area. And so he offers to establish his own farm as well in order to leave the blacks, by example, and kind of act as a quote, kind father to them. 

Angie: Okay, because I know you mentioned he was farming before, but has he had success in this? Like, does he know what he’s doing? 

Theresa: He has success in keeping his family alive through his farming efforts. But is he like earning a profit, taking his goods to market? No, because he can’t take anything to market. Right. 

Angie: Okay. So I guess I was asking from the perspective of like, is he in a place to be able to teach these other folks how to farm? Like teach? Yes. 

Theresa: Now to teach them to make money and become like entrepreneur. No, no, but never trust Brown to help you make money. He’s we all have friends that are different skills. Right. There you go. Yeah. 

Angie: No, what you’re gonna help move a couch. 

Theresa: Yeah, like you need a barn raised, you need to help learn when to plant, how much to plant, like that’s your man. 

Angie: Got it. Okay. Okay. Include the sheep. Always include the sheep. Yep. 

Theresa: Now, that was crazy to me. And I want to overstate this, or I don’t think you can overstate this is that Brown moving to a black community is wild during this time. 

Because no matter what side of the slavery issue you’re on, you’re not going to mix with them, let alone be the token white dude in their community. Love that for him. Okay. So it’s around this time that John’s family brings in this child who doesn’t look like them, a lot more melanin. And the child has ended up losing his family to a fire. 

And so it’s around like, so John’s just like, come with me, dude, you lost everything. And we can we can make it work. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, we’ve already got, you know, bunk beds that are four deep, we can just, you know, put you over here. 

Angie: Call it good, you’ll blend and just fine. 

Theresa: So John Brown is really in his element. He’s like the book goes into detail about how he’s inviting people over for dinner. They’re staying in his home, you know, for various reasons. He’s playing with their children. They’re all helping each other at their various farms. This is genuinely a community that he’s a part of. 

I love this. And it is so wholesome, so beautiful. And then for whatever reason, 1855, Brown joins his sons and his son and lawn Kansas, and they’re settling along the Ossawadome River. And this is where things start to amp up in the story. Okay, because December 1855, he helps defend Lawrence, which is the center of anti slavery settlers from an armed attack by pro slavery forces. 

Okay. And then because Kansas, I don’t know if you, I didn’t fully recognize this in full context, but Kansas was one of those states that didn’t necessarily have like, slavery, not slave holding state, they had to figure it out for themselves. So there were huge factions fighting within. I didn’t know that. Okay. Yeah. And so Brown and his family go because they’re like, well, shoot, we’re gonna, we’re gonna go for the anti slavery cause. And if we have the ability to make our voices heard, what better than a place that is looking to the side? Yeah. 

Angie: Okay, that makes sense. Yeah. Okay. 

Theresa: So he’s there. He’s obviously made his voice known. So this is leading to these attacks, right? Now, the following year, there’s going to be another attack in which Brown kind of goes on the offensive in Potawatomi Creek. And it’s during this time that there’s going to be five settlers that are killed. Now, here’s, here’s the what would happen was, okay, it’s May 24th, 1856, Brown is leading a raiding party of four of his sons, his son-in-law and two other men to Potawatomi Creek. 

And for the most part, this raid is kind of unplanned, it’s mostly spontaneous. Brown is acting in retaliation for a raid on the settling, or settlement the year before, in which he had to defend his own kind of deal. And apparently, during that time, the free state settlers in Kansas, you know, there’d been some killings, and there’s a ton of persistent threats by the pro-slavery settlers along the creek. 

Okay. And what’s worse is they’re viewing, this is not going to sound new, but they’re the pro-slavery people think of the dough-faced Northerners and how they just really don’t have much oomph to them. We can bully them, we can get them to follow our will. And then we can just steamroll everybody into taking away rights and doing what we want. 

Angie: This sounds strikingly familiar. 

Theresa: Right. So same story, different tune. Okay. Now, as all of this is happening, Brown gets a little upset. So he acts in retaliation. Okay. And so they go in and his men enter three cabins and they’re interrogating a number of people. Eventually, five of these men would be killed. With swords, with knives, some of them are killed quickly. There’s a couple others that are cut in many places. It takes a little longer. They’re not quite as oik. 

Okay. And then Brown and his men hit the bricks. They take off. Now, this is significant because while Brown and his men killed five pro-slavery settlers, they don’t kill the Southern settlers that they encounter. 

They’re going through and they’re sparing the life of the wife and teenage son of one of the men that they killed, even though that these people are witnesses and could identify them. 

Angie: Okay. Because I can actually, that makes sense. Yeah. With all of his former, like all of his beliefs as they are. Yeah. Yeah. 

Theresa: Because he’s like, look, the man is the household. He’s setting the tone. I’m hoping you’re going to see the error of your way. So I’m just going to cut the poison root out and hope the rest of the plants. Okay. Yeah. No, it makes perfect sense. 

Now, at another cabin, they end up interrogating two men and letting them go, convinced that they hadn’t threatened the free state settlers or been involved in violent actions. This is going to be their downfall, isn’t it? 

Angie: Yeah. A little bit. 

Theresa: A little bit. Is that the third house they go to that they spare the wife of one man, even when they kill the husband, but the wife they let live. All right. Now, this is happening two days after the caning of Charles Sumner that was discussed in episode 157. 

Angie: Okay. So did they know each other? No. 

Theresa: And I don’t believe he would have heard of the caning yet. Okay. But I just positioned this so that you hear like how all of this cloud of turmoil is going throughout the US. 

Angie: Right. How things are playing out. Yeah. 

Theresa: Now, Brown and his sons are going to continue to fight in the territory and in Missouri for the rest of this year. So it is not a peaceful existence. Okay. By the end of 1856, Brown is one of the most renowned, either hated or adored figures in what is called Bleeding Kansas. That’s a name. Yeah. Yeah. 

Okay. Now, in the East, he’s become known as Osawatomi Brown or Old Osawatomi. And this is like him standing up and defending the pro-slavery people coming and attacking him. Okay. 

And for some New England abolitionists, he’s kind of a quickly approaching this idea of like a cult figure. Okay. That makes sense. 

Now, what I found interesting from my understanding, and this is where I could be wrong. If he’s called Osawatomi Brown, they’re talking about how he’s standing up against pro-slavers. But if he’s called Potawatomi Brown, which is the second attack, now they are calling him crazy and heretical and hysterical and just as mindless killer. 

Angie: So based on the nickname used, which kind of cover which side of the fence you’re on with this guy? Exactly. Okay. That’s some kind of word power right there. 

Theresa: It is. And to have so many nicknames and you’re either kind of beloved, stand or upper and protective or assassinator at will. Do you boo? Yeah. So Brown, he ends up returning back east and he’s thinking pretty seriously about his plan for war against slavery. And he’s for whatever reason, imagining this kicking off in Virginia. And I don’t know if I ever fully understood why Virginia given all the places he’s lived. 

Angie: My guess is because I feel like at this time, Virginia is a bastion of slavery. 

Theresa: I mean, each slave holding state is its own bastion. 

Angie: I mean, that’s fair. But yeah, I feel like you hear, I don’t know, maybe just at least from my perspective, you hear a lot about Virginia slaveholders. Like that’s where the big ones are. 

Theresa: Okay, maybe. Moving on. 

Angie: As he’s going through this, not to say that like Georgia and Alabama don’t exist. 

Theresa: But you know what I mean, South Carolina was the first to secede. So let’s be honest. But anyhow, yeah, anyhow, he’s trying to raise money to fund the army that he’s going to need. 

Love this for him. Like the book is basically him saying, can I have $500? Like $500 like in 1850 money. Okay, that’s right go for right. And so he’s just like, well, how about $100? Do you have a thousand? 

Like our man is hustle in. Okay. Now it’s as early as 1854 that he’s thinking and talking and trying to organize a war against slavery in Virginia. And from the beginning, he seems to be fixated on Harper’s Ferry. 

Okay. Now the reason he’s focused on Harper’s Ferry is this is the site of a federal arsenal and armor. because we need this. Hey, if you’re going to start something, maybe start some place where you could outfit the rest of your army. Yeah. Now, 1857, his plans, they start to take some shape. It’s in March of that year that he hired a Connecticut forge master to make a thousand pikes. 

Angie: Oh, now, yeah, we need pikes. Okay. 

Theresa: Yeah, that is not. He’s thinking like we need weapons. Hikes are not necessarily needing a ton of training. 

Angie: Yeah. I’m just a visual is gnarly. 

Theresa: It is, it is. Now, allegedly, this is for use in Kansas, but actually be given the slaves who he believed are going to flock to him and form this guerrilla army state that he spends a month in Frederick Douglass’s house. 

Okay. And he’s planning his raid. He’s writing a provisional constitution for the revolutionary state that he’s hoping to create. Okay, love this. And for those that are interested, read this constitution. It is exciting. It is incredible. Yeah. 

Angie: Okay. I’m here for it. Let’s go. Yeah. That’s yeah. 

Theresa: Now, Douglass, he’s very sympathetic to Brown’s goals, but he kind of thinks this plan is suicidal. 

Angie: Right. So you have at least one friend that’s like, bro, I love what you’re doing here, but maybe could we just maybe tone it down a bit? 

Theresa: Yeah. Douglass is quoted in saying you’re walking into a perfect steel trap and you will never get out alive. Okay. Nevertheless, he introduces Brown to a guy named Shields Green, which is a who is a fugitive slave from South Carolina. Shields. Oh, okay. Like first off, Shields Green, that is the name of the arsenic green wallpaper. 

Angie: Didn’t even think of that. That’s awesome. Okay. 

Theresa: That’s all I could think of. There’s another there’s a better name coming. Okay. Now, December of 1858, Brown, he’s making headlines again for some of his exploits in the West. He’s invaded Missouri, where he’s killed a slave owner. He’s liberated 11 slaves and he brilliantly evades law enforcement officers as he’s leading these freed blacks to Canada. 

Angie: I don’t know why I didn’t see Canada coming. It’s the quickest way out. Yeah. No, it didn’t. Closer than Mexico. 

Theresa: Now, at this point or at some point during this trip, he ends up meeting a black printer named Osborn Perry Anderson, who would later take part in the Harper’s Ferry raid. So the cast of characters is growing as he’s continuing to meet and rub elbows with others. Now, this is happening even though it seems that Osborn Perry Anderson had a price of $250 on his head because he’s a wanted man. Now, Brown, I take it back, Brown is a wanted man with the price on his head. 

That makes more sense. So even though Brown has like literal wanted posters, he’s speaking in Ohio, New York, Massachusetts and Connecticut. Come get me, Bob. Yeah. I’m, hey, if you’re looking for me on the one on stage with the microphone. 

Angie: This is where I’ll be Tuesday at noon. Right. 

Theresa: Now, he ends up going back to his home in North Elba, New York in June of 1859. And this is for the last time. 

Angie: He seems with Elba is the black community that he was in, right? Exactly. Okay. 

Theresa: Now, it’s here that he ends up saying goodbye to wife and daughters. And it’s pretty likely he believes that this would be the last time he would see him. Okay. And he stoically accepted this sacrifice as the cost of his crusade against slavery. 

Angie: I mean, yeah, if you’re going to start a war, you should probably be prepared to. Yeah. Yeah. 

Theresa: Okay. You should count the cost. And it seems that he did and he found the cost high, but doable. But worth it. Yeah. Yeah. Now, he’s slightly less accepting of one son, a dude named Salman, who decided he’s not going to join his dad on the suicidal mission in Virginia. So this makes sense. 

Yeah. He’s got one son that he has fallen out with. Meanwhile, many of the other kiddos are like, well, we’re right or die. Let’s go. Right. 

Because yeah, but okay. So Brown and his sons, Oliver and Owen arrive in Harper’s Ferry on July 3rd, 1859. And it’s here that Brown runs a farm in Maryland. 

This is about seven miles from Harper’s Ferry. He’s expecting large numbers of men to enlist in his army. So this is July. By September, only 18 had arrived, including Brown’s sons Watson or Brown’s son or another one of his sons Watson. He’s got so many kids. It’s hard to keep everybody straight. And then it’s by mid-October that there’s a few more who who strangle in. Okay. 

Angie: So we’ve got like 22, 23, 21 all together. 

Theresa: Oh, okay. Now it is October 16th, 1859 that John Brown and 21 other men, five of whom are black, 16 are white, rated the federal arsenal at Harper’s Ferry. The youngest member of their party is 18. 

Okay. The old boy are all consenting adults. We are all considering adults. He’s not he’s not taken kiddos into this. The oldest man named Danger Field Newby. Oh, love it. 

Angie: Danger Field Newby. I’m imagining him already. Let’s go. 

Theresa: Danger Field Newby is a 44 year old fugitive slave from Virginia who’s trying to rescue his wife from bondage. Okay. So our man Danger Field is already got top billing in my heart. Now Brown’s plans, as we’ve noted from what Frederick Douglass says, are fantastic, but some might say insane. 

A little bit more cookie. Now his ideas are going like he wants to use the arms in the arsenal as well as these old fashioned pikes that he’s had manufactured to begin a guerrilla war against slavery. That’s his goal. 

Okay. He believes that the core of his army is going to be these mostly white band of raiders who are going to seize the arsenal. But soon he knows, he knows deep down in the soul that hundreds or even thousands of slaves are going to flock to him to join him in the fight against this quote, particular institution. 

Angie: Oh, okay. Okay. 

Theresa: Now he’s predicted that once the word gets out about this raid, that slaves throughout the region are just going to swarm to the hive. That would be ideal. Yeah, that is the hope for and he’s like getting the word out slowly, surely, seeding it, trying to get this going. Yeah. 

Yeah. So his small little group, his army, if you will, arrived at Harper’s Ferry at night and they quickly secured the federal army, nope, armory and the arsenal. Later they’re also going to take over Hall’s rifle words, which manufactured weapons for the national government. 

Okay. They cut the telegraph wires and then he might have easily have seized the weapons in the town, liberated the slaves in the neighborhood and then taken to the hills, or he could have simply just destroyed the armory and blown up the town. Like these are the things he had access to. 

Angie: Wait, so he may have done either option? He could. 

Theresa: Like if you look at like what, if you’re in this situation, what could you do? These are the things he could have done. Okay. Got it. Does that make sense? Yes. 

Okay. He doesn’t blow up the town. He doesn’t quite, you know, do all the things that I could have said, right? But during the raid, what does happen is he captures a number of slave owners in the area, including a guy named Lewis Washington. That’s a name. Lewis Washington is a great grand nephew of former president George Washington. 

George Washington. Yeah. Okay. Now, Brown doesn’t kill any of the captured men. He goes above and beyond to protect the men and make sure they’re not harmed. Okay. He was intentional about getting Lewis Washington because Lewis Washington had a sword from great uncle George. The sword. 

Angie: And if I get that sword, swords or symbols, just got it. 

Theresa: The sword itself was a gift from Frederick the Great. Love this. Literally in my notes, I wrote, Angie, you’re welcome. Thank you so much, tipsat. Now, Brown doesn’t want this sword for shits and giggles. He wants to give it to a black fighter as a symbol. 

Angie: Yeah, because symbols are powerful. Yes. 

Theresa: And he recognizes the power in that symbol. Yeah. Love this. Okay. So meanwhile, back at Harper’s Ferry, the Raiders end up killing a railroad baggage handler who ironically, the first person to die is a free black man who is. Oh, I hate that. Okay. And this happens when he refuses the order to halt. From their party. Yeah. So, okay. Brown’s group says, Hey, stop. And he’s like, no. Thanks. 

Angie: Trying to do my job. Moving on. 

Theresa: Yeah. Now, there’s a gunfight that kicks off. It kills a few townspeople, including the mayor. Oh, that’s unfortunate. Yep. Now, Brown at one point, he stops a passenger train. He holds it hostage for a while and then he releases it. That train continues on to Washington, DC, where the crew tattletales to a bunch of officials that Brown has seized Harper’s Ferry. 

Angie: Was that the goal? Like we’re letting you go, season go, title? No. 

Theresa: The goal wasn’t to spread awareness that he was doing this. At least Brown’s goal wasn’t to let them do this. But Brown didn’t want to. Brown was too kind, right? That’s what it boils down to. This is a mistake of empathy and kindness. Gotcha. 

Angie: Because I feel like it could have gone the other way. 

Theresa: Oh, it really could have. It really could have. Now, he remains at the armory waiting for these slaves to flock to him because he knows this is going to happen. The slaves never came. Instead, it towns people and farmers who surround the armory. Now, the civilians are probably not strong enough to kind of dislodge him, to kick him out, but they do keep him pinned down. And Brown, he’s trying to negotiate with the civilians. His emissaries, including his son Watson, are shot under a white flag. So, okay, the book goes into excruciating detail as Brown like is listening to his children die. 

Yeah, okay. Now, the next day, October 18th, US Marines under the command of Army Brevet Colonel Robert E. Lee captured Brown in the engine house on the armory grounds. By this time, most of the raiders are dead or wounded. By the end of the raid of the 22, this includes Brown, who’d been involved 10 of Brown’s men, including his sons, Watson and Oliver, are dead or mortally wounded. Hey, five, including Brown, are captured. Okay. 

Now, for those of you doing some simple math, that means seven escaped to our later captured in Pennsylvania and returned to Virginia for trial and execution. Okay. The other five, including Brown’s son Owen, make their way to the safe havens in Canada to the remote parts of the north. Okay. And all but Owen Brown are later going to serve in the Union Army. 

Angie: Because Owen Brown is in the great white north of Canada? 

Theresa: Yeah, he’s, I think he just pieces out never returned south. But the others who escape are like, I’m gonna, I’m gonna double down. Yeah, I mean, I feel like if you’re, 

Angie: if your leader is willing to sacrifice the things that he sacrificed for, then his cause is worthy. Probably we’re joining up on the next. Yeah. 

Theresa: Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah, on the next turn, I’m going to roll net now. That’s what you hope, but you’re at least going to, you’re at least going to shake them dice. Now, the men that he’s captured, the browns, the men that Brown had captured, that’s where he makes the critical error, because historians tend to agree that he spent way too much time protecting them from harm and stuff fleeing. Like if he had just taken his troops and disappeared up into the hills, he could have rallied troops, he could have done that guerrilla war, but he abandoned the guerrilla war because he felt the need to protect the people that he had, he captured. What are you protecting them from? From the bullets coming into the house when he could have usually snuck out of the armory. Gotcha. Okay. 

Angie: I just, I feel like in this particular instance, if I’m a rebel leader and I have taken hostages and outside are the hostages, I don’t know, friends and family, and they are firing in, I’m going to do this and then let the hostages say, hey, yo, it’s just me in here. Open the door. 

Theresa: Like you would think, but Brown doesn’t make that move, right? And I think that is ultimately why Harper’s Ferry goes as it does. Yeah, that makes sense. Now, Brown is wounded, obviously captured. He’s moved to Charleston, Virginia, and then 10 days later, his trial begins. 

And it was Virginia, now it’s West Virginia. So no need to email me. I’m well aware. 

Name changed. He’s charged with treason, murder, and conspiring with slaves to rebel, and he’s convicted on November 2nd and sentenced to death. Before his sentencing, he tells the court that his actions against slavery are consistent with God’s commandments, which I’m here for. And he would go on to say, quote, now if it is deemed necessary that I should forfeit my life for the furtherance of the ends of justice and mingle my blood with the blood of the millions in the slave country whose rights were disregarded by the wicked, cruel, and unjust knackments, I say, let it be done. Love that. And it was just like, oh, he stood on business. Now, in the month between his sentencing on November 2nd and his execution on December 2nd, he’s writing some brilliant letters that are creating this case in the minds of the Northerners and giving him this Christ-like martyr appearance who’s willing to give his life so that the slaves can go free. Yeah, okay. Frederick Douglass would later go on to say that if he lived for the slave, but John Brown was willing to die for the slave. 

Angie: And Brown, what does that say? Holy bees. Yeah, yeah. 

Theresa: Brown welcomed his end declaring, quote, I am worth inconceivably more to hang than for any other purpose. So he knew. He knew. He’s like, my death is going to be so brilliant. 

It is going to do so much more than me breathing ever could. Yeah, wow. And in the book, the author makes it abundantly clear that it’s Brown’s writing that radicalized the people so much more so than his actions to Harper’s Berry. 

Yeah. Now, for abolitionists, for anti-flavory activists, both black and white, Brown is this, this hero. He’s a martyr. 

He conceivably like when you think about it, you know, in the grand scheme of things, he is the harbinger of the end of slavery. Oh, okay. Yeah, that makes sense. Right. 

Like this is the crystallizing moment. Most Northern whites, especially those that are not committed to abolition, they’re aghast at the violence of his actions. Yeah, which makes sense. 

It’s pretty dramatic. Yet there’s also a ton of widespread support for him in the region. Now, Northern’s tend to basically see him as this anti-slavery state, like Saint, but he’s brave. He’s kind of extremist, bit of a lunatic. Maybe even a little bit of a threat to the union. 

Angie: But he’s good. But who isn’t one that got something to say, you know? Yeah. 

Theresa: The future Republican governor of Massachusetts, a man named John A. Andrew, he sums up a lot of the feelings that many Northerners had when he refused to endorse Brown’s tactics or the wisdom of the raid, but declares that, quote, John Brown himself is right, unquote. Love that. 

Angie: So I don’t have to agree with your methods, but you’re right. 

Theresa: Yeah, like, you know, love the thought process behind it. Now, most Republican politicians, they’re worried that they’re going to be tarred by his extremism, and this will leave them to lose the next election. The Democrats or what remained of the wigs, who would be the constitutional unionists, they’re fearing that Brown’s raid is going to polarize the nation. And this would put Republicans in power and chase the self out of the union. Shocking. 

Yeah. So they can see the writing on the wall. Now, for white Southerners, Brown is the worst nightmare. He is a fearless, committed abolitionist. He’s not that pasty face dough boy that’s going to sit down and let somebody take his lunch. He’s willing to accompany blacks and die to enslavery. 

Angie: So I would think that like just anyway, whatever. No, no, no, go for it. I just like when you to me, and I understand the the generational belief of growing up as a slaveholder, right, like you it almost has that ordained by God complex, right? But you would think that if you are watching a another white man, be like, yo, this is wrong, and I am willing to die for it, that you might start questioning where you stand in the grand scheme of things. 

Theresa: Well, and I think even if nobody wrote it down, it put cracks into their mental state. It had to have like, 

Angie: I can’t like I said, I know that you’re coming from this, this background of generational, my grandfather was a slaveholder, I’m a slaveholder, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, for hundreds of years, right? But like at the same time, you would think if if you’re seeing this, you’re like, but maybe maybe I’m wrong. 

Theresa: Oh, you know, as it turns out, they they’re 

Theresa: people too, like right, or at least somebody else thinks they’re people and what if they’re right? 

Angie: Yeah, like you would yeah, whatever, it just it blows my mind that thought processes don’t immediately start to change at a moment like that, but humans are human and we’re going to take our time to it takes time to change your mind. Yeah, it really, really does even even when you like even when history is going to look back and be like, yeah, that was absolutely the wrong thing to do. But right, like that’s that’s how humanity works. 

Theresa: But either way, this is what leads many Southerners to believe that Brown’s the greatest threat to slavery that they’ve ever witnessed. And him. Yeah, like he made them shake in their boots. And most of them tend to have at least a vague fear of slave rebellions. They’ve had a couple, it’s been awful. They’ve seen Haiti revolt, bad news bears for them. But their belief is that because basically since when Brown had this rally cry, and nobody flocked to his aid, that that means that the slaves are content. 

Of course. They’re just so happy. Well, they’re at least happier to stay with us than to join him. 

So they must be, you know, at least marginally. Now, this, okay, like this would kind of stir up, you know, anxiety about what if there’s another John Brown? What if there’s, you know, more armed black slaves that are led by whites that are going to destroy our Southern society? And this is echoing in their brains. 

Angie: Right. Which I mean, is very reasonable to be concerned about. 

Theresa: Yeah. And it would be John Brown, who would get hanged on December 2nd, 1859. And even though he did all of this work, it would be Lincoln who gets credit for freeing the slaves despite him put in the effort. I mean, that checks. Yeah. But that is the story of John Brown. Wild. Yeah. Okay. 

Angie: I wondered if we were heading this direction with your previous stories. 

Theresa: Yeah. I have to ask, was John Brown on your list? He was. 

Angie: But I didn’t know anything other than he was wild. That was what I knew. 

Theresa: And the 24 hour length audio book, I was just like, oh, my gosh, I just, it was so good. I couldn’t skip parts, but I was just like, all right, I got to summarize this. I got to summarize this. I can’t display the entirety of these chapters. 

Angie: Yeah. I’ve encountered moments like that where like, I can’t just retell you this whole book. But I’d like to, but I cannot. Otherwise, we’ll be here for 17 days. Yeah. All right. I love that. Yeah, I love him. 

I love that he stood on his conviction. Like this, this is actually what we’re going to do. And if this is how I go out, then this is how I was meant to go out very much. Seems like his motto. 

Theresa: Exactly. And like, in the book, they did have this touching part where they talk about how his wife made great effort to go see him right before he’s executed. And he doesn’t want her to come. 

He likes us don’t know, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, I love you. Right. The problem is like, I’m pretty good with my resolve here. I’m going to crumble if you show up. Could you please just don’t? 

Yeah, like, I love you so much that I’m going to say, please no, because it’s going to hurt me. But she does come. They do have several hours together. And it is very touching. 

Angie: And yeah, I wonder if it started with her just walking in and backhanding him. 

Theresa: I mean, I have a feeling there’s no way she would, right? Like she knew this was coming. Yeah. 

Angie: Yeah. I mean, given what you said about there, him going home to see him, her and her daughters one more time, like that makes sense that she was fully aware that that was happening, but that would not stop me from backhanding my own husband when I got there. 

Speaker 4: There. There. 

Angie: Like you could have done this differently. Okay. And now let me hug you. Yeah, maybe. 

Theresa: And maybe, you know, I don’t know. I wasn’t there at the time. 

Angie: It would be an interesting wall to be a fly on. 

Theresa: Theoretically, this could be its own episode. 

Angie: I don’t know how long your story is. It should be mine. Yeah, mine is regular. 

Theresa: Regular length. Okay. Yeah. In which case, thank you all for tuning in. Appreciate you listening to me regurgitating and gushing about John Brown. Can you tell us the name of the book one more time? The book was John Brown abolitionist. And it was by David S. Reynolds. Really recommended. Even the audio version was fabulous. Okay. Here for it. Many a floor was mopped during the listening of this book. 

Angie: Technically, it was one floor mopped many a times. Yeah. 

Theresa: Actually accurate. But if you are also one floor that’s been mopped many a times and you’re thinking, you know what? I feel like my sister floor could really enjoy listening to this as well. Rate, review, subscribe, share this with your sister floor. And on that note, goodbye. 

Theresa: Bye.