Listen to the episode here.

This week, Theresa and Angie do what they do best.

Theresa kicks things off with the story of Mary Ellen Pleasant. This incredible capitalist, becomes a millionaire in 1800s San Francisco, invests heavily in Black communities, all while fighting lawsuits accusing her of fraud, theft, and even voodoo. Of course, Theresa is a huge fan.

Angie takes things up a notch by sharing the tale of Boudica. That’s right. Buckle up for the British heavy hitter. Boudica, who was already outspoken against the Roman overloads, develops a burning rage after getting flogged and witnessing her daughters’ sexual assaults. So she does what any reasonable person does: rouses a rabble of up to 100k countrymen and burns the Roman world to the ground.

This story pairs well with:
John Brown

Transcript

Theresa: Hello and welcome to the Unhinged History Podcast, the podcast where two ADHDers and possibly more comorbidities are going to study history like it’s the only thing we want to do on this earth, and then join forces and once a week tell each other the stories we’ve only recently learned. I’m host one, I’m Teresa, and that is host two. Hi Mandy. Hi. Yeah. Long radio silence. 

Angie: Sorry, he’s doing the thing where I think you can hear him. I can’t. Okay. But now I have something to edit out. There you go. We’re starting off strong. Who’s first this week? 

Theresa: Uh that is you. You get to go first this week. 

Angie: God. All right. Well, I don’t think I was prepared to go first this week, but let’s go. 

Theresa: I mean, if you want, I can go first. I’m I’m open to breaking tradition. I’m fine either way. 

Angie: I’m I’m just mentally not prepared for my day. 

Theresa: Okay, then I’m gonna go first, just so you can start to steal yourself to the sticking place. Okay, thanks. Yeah. And that was a bastardization of Shakespeare. It’s supposed to be screw yourself to the sticking place. Um, anyhow, it works. My story was recommended from a listener who commented on Instagram. Their name is Joss Hair Artist. They are somebody who does hair. A hairstylist. 

Angie: Um I believe the term is artist, so they are a hair artist. 

Theresa: They are a hair artist, uh, which is very different than a sandwich artist. Um Back. Go shade to subway. Um now they recommended that I do Mary Ellen Pleasant. 

Angie: Okay. I can’t say off the top of my head that’s a familiar name. Fantastic. 

Theresa: My sources. National Park Service. Oh, I’m shocked. Uh Mary Ellen Pleasant, the Gilder Learman Institute of American History, Mary Ellen Pleasant, Freedom Fighting Entrepreneur by Lynn M. Hudson, and Women and the American Story, Mary Ellen Pleasant. So if I hadn’t said it before, we’re covering Mary Ellen Pleasant. 

Angie: I didn’t think I got that the first time. Yeah. 

Theresa: I’m, you know, I’m I’m here to really break it down to the calm denominator. Now, from what we know, Mary Ellen Pleasant tells people in interviews that she’s born to free parents August 19th, 1814. One source says 1819, there’s gonna be some fun stuff because this was yeah, in the early 1800s. Right. Maybe, maybe. So while she claims to be born to free parents, there’s others, including an author of a semi-fictionalized mammy pleasant named Helen Holdridge. She claims that Pleasant’s born to slaves in Georgia. But Mary Ellen says, Nope, nope, one free black mother and one native Hawaiian father. So whether she’s slave or free. Pleasant tells everyone that her childhood is one spent in freedom. 

Okay. Now, we kick off in Nantucket, Massachusetts, and in her autobiography, she explained that when she was about six years of age, she sent to Nantucket to live with a Quaker woman named Mary Hoosie. Uh this is an older white woman who ran a dry goods store there. Is this um oh my god. 

Angie: No, Sheresa Mima, is it? No, this isn’t Anti Mike. Okay. Okay. Terrion, sorry, my brain just was like, oh, maybe I do know this name. 

Theresa: Wouldn’t that be cool? No. Um, but anyhow, so this woman, Mary Hoosie, has her help earner busy shop, that dry goods shop. And apparently it’s common for black children to be raised by adults other than their parents at this time. Many black Americans tend to move frequently because of jobs and safety, and they don’t want to bring their children with them in this instability, so they tend to make a painful decision to have their children live with other people to give more educational opportunities as well as that stability that their lifestyle lacks. 

Angie: Um I’m assuming y you’re referring to l like free black Americans in the north. 

Theresa: I’m just gonna say yes, because you know, different reasons. 

Angie: This is 1814, so I’m thinking I don’t okay, got it. Yeah, so she isn’t a free state. Okay, perfect. 

Theresa: Okay, well, Nan in Massachusetts she’s in a free state. Let me back up there. But being born in Georgia, um Could could be sus. Yeah, could be sus. Now, Nantucket is one of the largest free black communities in the state of Massachusetts, but there’s a ton of segregation that’s still endemic. Now, even though we see that slavery was abolished in this state, black appar Americans are still expected to live apart from the white residents. 

They have separate churches, schools, neighborhoods, you name it. Right. But Pleasant would go along and brag about her ability when she’s working in that dry goods shop to bring in customers and get them to buy things of me, she said. Good for her. So she she works it even as a little one. Remember, she this is like six years old when she starts this. And on this small island, she meets and mingles with sailors, hucksters, and conductors of the Underground World Railroad. 

Okay. Now, apparently Nantucket was one of the busiest ports in North America, and this is a result of the booming whale trade that’s going on. Booming. Booming. And here’s the crazy thing. Because this is the busiest port, and it’s a whaling town, men of the area are out to sea, and it’s the women who are running the businesses. Okay, this checks. It it’s like it makes sense, but I just had a hard time wrapping my brain around early 1800s women running things. 

Yeah. So she grows up in this area and then moves to Boston. We don’t know a ton about her life in Boston, but it seems likely that she works in a tailor shop where she meets her first husband, James Smith. Smith is wealthy. He’s also an abolitionist. Okay, good. Now, as with Mary Ellen, racial background is unclear. 

Some claim he’s Cuban, other believe him to be a black American. Okay. So there’s just going to be a lot of this ambiguity throughout this entire thing. Now, ambiguity inside, he ends up dying and he leaves Pleasant a large inher inheritance. So Smith died in the 1940s, and according to W. E. B. Du Bois 1840s. 1840s, thank you for translating. 

Angie: I was like, hold on, we have jumped time. What is going on? 

Theresa: Oh, there’s a lot going on. No. But okay, so according to E.B. 

Angie: Du Bois, so time travels real this whole time. 

Theresa: I wish. So there’s there’s things that Pleasant inherited as much as $50,000 in 1840. 

Angie: Okay. That’s a chunk of change. 

Theresa: It is a chunk of change. Now, inflation calculators, they only go back to 1919. According to 1919, that’s 1.7 million. Right. But then just trying to do some back of the napkin math, it’s claiming that would be only 1.9 million. Which doesn’t make sense. That you see what I mean? Like that is a huge jump. That is 70 something years, and you’re telling me that that’s only point two million? 

I call I call bupkiss. But anyhow, huge chunk of change. Right. Now, again, EWB Du Boys, he says 50,000. 

There’s some sources that say as low as 15. I mean, either way, it’s a chunk of change. She’s got some money. Now, by this point, she’s married a new man named John James Pleasant. They have one daughter together named Lizzie. And the three of them moved to San Francisco. This is at the height of the gold rush in 1849. Okay. John worked as a ship cook at sea, and there’s speculation that Mary might have left the East Coast to escape reprisal for her abolition work. Ooh, okay. 

So I’m I’m loving the mystery. Now, for those of us playing at home, it’s important for us to remember that the United States did not look like the United States the entire time that the United States was a thing. California is part of Mexico until 1848, and then it becomes a free state in 1850. Right. So the racial diversity of this state is wild because we have many indigenous and Mexican people who made it more welcoming to black people than other places in the U.S. This makes sense. In hindsight, it all makes sense, right? Now, black people are still facing a grip of racism in California. 

For instance, in 1852, the state passes its own fugitive slave act. I did not know that. That was one of those key things that I learned. I was like, I’m dropping this note in here because that feels very important. 

Mm-hmm. So now she’s in San Francisco. This is peak gold fever going on. And she did some incredible investing to that nest egg that she got because she’s using it to open laundries and boarding houses that she’s staffing with mostly black individuals. Good for her. Now she’s owning properties in San Francisco, Oakland, and eventually she’s gonna buy property in Canada as well. 

Angie: She is on the move. 

Theresa: She is. And she describes, I’ve got a quote, I can’t quite break down what it fully means, but this is what she says about her investment strategy. I divided this money among Fred Langford and William West of Weston Harper. They put my money at 10% interest, and I did an exchange business, sending down gold and having exchanged into silver. So either way, girl is lending her money with 10% interest and then making sure that she’s getting that gold and silver money. Good for her. Now here’s the part that threw me. 

Despite this woman having considerable wealth and actively working to increase said wealth, she takes up work as a housekeeper in some in some of San Francisco’s most prominent merchants. Why? Okay. Now here’s the crazy thing. Because that was my first time. 

Angie: She wants to. 

Theresa: No, because this woman, I think she can’t sit still well. And I think also, like she’s able to parlay this into just brilliance. Because here’s the thing. 1850, 92% of California’s residents are dudes. 

Angie: Right. So she’s making more money. 

Theresa: It all of the job opportunities that are open to women are extremely lucrative, okay? Because if she’s doing domestic work like she did on the East Coast, this is now so much more higher paying on the West Coast where there’s no ladies. 

Angie: Yeah, okay. This makes sense. 

Theresa: She’s making bank as she’s working as a renowned cook for the wealthiest residents of San Francisco. Okay. Now taking this job as a cook allows her to obscure the extent of her wealth. She’s able to hide it. I’m not so wealthy. Look at me. 

I have a job just like you. Now the press, they kind of latch on to her. Again, one of few women, woman of color, they can tell she’s got something going on. So they start referring to her as Mammy Pleasant. And she disdains this term because Mammy is the stereotypical representation of a devoted black housekeeper. And it’s got roots in slavery, right? Right. 

But by, you know, kind of hatefully adopting this and kind of going with it, she in using Mammy Pleasant, she’s able to convince the white folk around her that she’s non-threatening and likable. Whatever works. Now, here’s the here’s the the just crime de ressance. You know what? Here’s the best part. Yeah. Here’s here’s the part I’ve been getting to. These jobs provided her with free investment advice because she’s listening in to the conversations between the rich and powerful people. 

Angie: Insider trading. I love it. Yes. Yes. 

Theresa: And so she’s very secretive about all of her financial details, but she is continuing to invest in real estate. She’s investing in mining stock, and these are the two biggest industries in San Francisco during this time. Shocked. Now, in the 19 or nope, in the 1890 census, she lists her profession as capitalist. I love that. She knew who she was. 

Angie: Get it, girlfriend. That is hilarious. 

Theresa: Now this wealth that she’s accumulating really enables her to give incredible amounts to her community. She contributes to, it’s called the Anthonyum Building. And the Anthony Building, if you look it up right now, it’s going to tell you that the Anthony and Building is in Indiana. There was an Anthonyum building in San Francisco. And this was a prominent institution in San Francisco’s early black community. It was founded in 1853. It’s a two-story building, and it the first floor operated as a saloon, and then the second floor is a library and educational institute. 

And it’s awesome as a place of civil rights planning. Yes, that’s so cool. She invested like and she just helped create this whole hub, right? Now she’s also supporting the black press and the American Methodist Episcopal Zion Church. 

Angie: So she is even diversifying her um Philanthropic efforts. Yeah. Yeah. 

Theresa: Now this woman is still an incredible abolitionist. And we have very few records that are part of this life, but there are sources that suggest that in 1858, she shelters Archie Lee, who’s an enslaved man on the run from his master who wanted to bring him back to Mississippi. 

Angie: But he made it to California, right? 

Theresa: He made it to California, but California had its own Fugitive Slave Act. Right. 

Angie: Okay. I’m just making sure like I’m placing her still in California. 

Theresa: Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Now, as she’s establishing this huge financial empire, she’s also being that agent of the Underground Railroad. You know, airgrowth RG Lee. Now, her abolitionist network that she established on the East Coast starts really serving her over on the on the West Coast as well. There are 20th century interviews with black San Franciscans that revealed that she’s in regular contact with the abolitionists in New England. Okay. At some point, this inspires her to move to Can or to travel to Canada and meet with John Brown. 

Angie: Your guy, John My Guy John Brown. Now, before John Brown led his infamous raid at Harper’s Ferry, which I ended up covered in episode 159 titled They Haven’t Repo’d the Couch Yet. Which that title makes sense in context. 

Angie: It’s funny how ninety percent of the titles make sense in context, and the ten percent that make sense in general are like, wait, what did we do there? 

Theresa: What yeah, why were we were retired? 

Angie: We okay. 

Theresa: Okay, so she meets John Brown in Canada. Now this is this is kind of the crazy thing. Because we have most of the accounts of this raid, they mentioned that John Brown received a uh support from this committee known as the Secret Six. The Secret Six don’t mention Mary Ellen Pleasant who supported him. So it’s kind of like super secret there, right? Even beyond the super secret. 

thing. But this would place uh Pleasant among the funders of her of the raid. That and the raid itself, okay. So when John Brown’s raid at Harper’s Ferry, for those of you who haven’t listened to 159 yet, that is one of the inciting incidents for the Civil War. That there was a white abolitionist who was ready to go out in a blaze of glory to stop slavery and believed it was going to take a militant action like this. So this fine funding of his efforts, this is part of her f entrepreneurial legacy. 

Okay. Which is mind-blowing to me. Now historians have suggested that she’s helping multiple humans escape their enslaving captors as she’s establishing the California Underground Railroad, which I didn’t fully think existed until this. 

Angie: That is a wild thought to think because I feel like California is so far removed from the rest of the American story at this time. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. 

Theresa: And then we have a report that towards the near near the end of her life, she does an interview with a reporter where she comments that she helped fund John Brown’s raid. 

Angie: Okay. Okay. 

Theresa: So our girl owns it, right? Now she stands on business the entire time and does a ton, right? Because California, even though it’s a free state, San Francisco is this segregated area. Now, she and a bunch of other black activists are fighting for equal access to ballot boxes, education, and public transportation. 

Angie: Yes. That is wild to think this is happening in the 1850s. 

Theresa: It’s wild to think it’s happening in California. 

Angie: And well, yeah, like the place and the time are wild. Yeah. 

Theresa: So she, as she’s doing all of this, right? There’s these anti-black laws and practices inside the state. Now, public transportation is going to be one of the first battlegrounds for this this movement. She ends up being one of the first black women to fight against the Jim Crow street cars in 1866. And this is where she brings complaints against two streetcar companies, the Omnibus Railroad and the North Beast and Mission Railroad Company. In the first one, uh she files a suit against the omnibus for putting her off the car, basically throwing her off. Now, there’s newspaper coverage, and this is she ends up pulling back her complaint after the newspaper coverage because she had been, quote, informed by the agents of the companies that Negroes would hereby or hereafter be allowed to write in the car. And she goes, Good, that’s what I wanted. 

Angie: I throw my complaint. Yes. 

Theresa: The second time, this is where a streetcar driver refuses to stop for her, even though there’s room on the car. She already has her tickets. And since this is the case, she sues the streetcar company for denying services to black citizens. This case goes all the way to the California Supreme Court, which declared segregation to be on streetcars to be unconstitutional. 

Angie: There you go. Good job, California. 

Theresa: Now, even though she wins that, there was a case in the or this it does reverse a ruling that reverses five hundred dollars with the damages that a lower court had awarded to her. So she loses five hundred dollars but gains rights for everybody else. 

Angie: I think the $500 is worth it. She can afford it. Yes. She’s not hurting it. Yeah. 

Theresa: Um, one historian notes that it’s her financial and political influences that led to the repeal of the law that blant that banned black testimony in California courts. Oh, okay, okay. So mover and shaker in everything she does. Good for her. 1869, she opens her first boarding house in the city, and this is an exclusive establishment that is frequented by the robber barons and railroad tycoons. 

Angie: At a bo in a boarding house? That’s wild. 

Theresa: I think it’s an upscale boarding house, right? Like this doesn’t sound like a flop house. This sounds like boutique hotel. Yeah, that’s what I’m okay. Yeah. 

Angie: But Can you imagine robber barons showing up at her house because she was once their cook and they’re just like looking for that corn beef? 

Theresa: Like they’re like, hey, um, I need that mac and cheese recipe. 

Angie: You know the one, thank you. Yeah. 

Theresa: Uh went I went to my family’s food uh thing and somebody put raisins in the potato salad, and I just needed to tell you that I missed you. 

Angie: Please. Yeah. It’s it. Yeah. 

Theresa: So even though she’s got tons of influence, gobs of wealth, she is not immune from scandal. Of course not. She would end up spending her final years just embroiled in controversy with her business partner who’s a wealthy Scotsman named Thomas Bell. 

Angie: I did not have wealthy Scotsman on my bingo card for this story, but it checks. 

Theresa: Honestly, it’s the Scots who are involved in everything. Now she in the 1970s, she moves in with her she moved her business and built a new mansion with her business partner named Thomas Bell. Now, Thomas Bell is the vice president of the Bank of California, and she’s living there with him, his wife, who’s named Teresa, and their children. 

Okay. And even though she’s part owner of the property, she continues to hide her financial staus from the public, and she portrays herself as the family’s domestic servant. That’s wild. Our girl likes to hide money. 

Angie: Yeah, okay, hide money, but you don’t have to play the servant. Like that’s that’s wild to me. 

Theresa: It it is wild to me. And I feel like this was just her part of her mask, right? She felt safer hiding. I feel safer hiding $20 bills and books in coats, in purses. 

Yeah, okay. But I don’t have her level of wealth, and so maybe I would obscure my wealth that much too. Now by the 1880s, she’s got this empire that is including boarding houses, homes in San Francisco and Oakland. She’s got a ranch in Sonoma, and she’s got a crap ton of investments in all of these resources around her. That’s crazy. This makes her a huge target for detractors, creditors, and politicians. 

Angie: Uh well, yeah. 

Theresa: Yes. Surprise, surprise. She’s a woman, she’s a woman of color. That would happen today, par for the course to the 1880s. Yeah. She is mentioned in multiple lawsuits by wealthy Californians. They’re accusing her of fraud, theft, and even voodoo. 

Angie: Okay. I’m so sorry, but that would do nothing but make me laugh. Yes. Done at all. You’re right. 

Theresa: I would just frame the voodoo lawsuits on the wall. Yeah. 

Angie: Yeah, that that’s that would be, yeah. 

Theresa: They would be right next to the family portrait. Yep. Wedding photo, voodoo suit. You know. In 1883, she becomes involved in this really complicated situation. There’s a young woman named Sarah Alpha Hill Sharon. And she Sarah claims that she secretly married this named William Sharon. 

He’s a wealthy investor. And she sues for divorce and accused William of being unfaithful. And Mary Ellen serves as her prime witness and supported the validity the validity of the marriage contract. Okay. Now, the truth is, apparently, Mary Ellen and Sarah secretly conspired to claim that Sarah and William were married, and they worked together to blackmail William, and they were almost successful. 

Angie: Oh, okay. 

Theresa: So this is some hey girl. Um, Now, the first trial awarded Sarah with money, but the marriage contract was found invalid on appeal. And then during this whole thing, Mary Ellen’s character is attacked during trial because of course it is. She’s going to be demonized regardless of what she does, let alone in some kind of like scandalous dealings. 

During this trial, she’s accused of being a quote, babyseller or an evil domestic worker. Okay. Which I’m just like, next. Um, then this there’s also a racist, it’s very racist stereotype that is quite the opposite of the mammy persona that she was accused of developing earlier in life. And her decision to testify really damages this Mammy Pleasant persona, and this kind of starts to really erode a lot of that public any kind of public support that she might have had. 

And we’re talking like according to sources, the beginning of the trial, Mary Ellen is more akin to Mammy Pleasant and is very trustworthy. By the end, it’s just destroyed. Now, on top of this, there’s even more shit that happens because it’s 1892 when Thomas Bell dies in an accident at their mansion. And this causes his wife, Teresa, and Mary Ellen to fight over his inheritance in court for years because they both live in the house, they both partly own it. It just seems very tenuous. 

Angie: So we didn’t have a clear line of Right, okay. 

Theresa: Now, of course, the relationship between these two women sours. Surprise, surprise. And newspapers continue to paint Mary Ellen as much more untrustworthy. This ticks. I mean, like you can see the downfall happening, right? Now, she spends the last years of her life defending herself against creditors in court. Hate that for her. 

I do too. She’s got a string of bad bad investments that further complicate her situation. And the fight with the Bell family significantly decreases her worth. 

She would end up passing away July 11th, January 11th, 1904. So at one point in her life, she’s a literal millionaire. Right. And by the end of her life, her inheritance is only worth $10,000, which is still tremendous amount of money for 1904 money. Yeah. 

Angie: Yeah, it is. Now, this whole time she has had a daughter, right? Yes. Is the daughter in California? Unclear, I didn’t look that up. I’d be curious to know who got the inheritance. Probably daughter. I would think. Yeah. 

Theresa: Now, here’s kind of a crazy thing. So the San Francisco examiner, when she died, left the following headline. Mammy Pleasant will work weird spells no more. Mysterious old Negro woman at 89 ends a life of schemes and varied fortune. 

Angie: Now you know what? If that was me, I wouldn’t be mad. 

Theresa: But like, I so yes and no, right? Now, when Josh Hare Artist mentioned I should cover her, it said Millionaire, San Francisco, ghost story twist. And so apparently she learned about Mary Ellen on a ghost tour. 

Okay. And so I’m assuming, as per usual, there is a shred of truth that was taken and fully elaborated on by a ton of tour guides who continue to guilt the Lily and guilt the Lily. And now we end up with her being this voodoo priestess that is doing all this black magic behind the scenes to run her schemes. 

Angie: That also haunts this house. 

Theresa: Highly likely, right? Okay. Now, I will say, like, and just before anybody like fully jumps in and goes, no, no, no, I’ve seen her ghost. Okay. See also Sarah Winchester and the Winchester Mystery House that I covered, where Sarah Winchester was not the crazy woman. The mystery house is not that insane when you hear her background. Or see the episode on Aunt Julia Brown Voodoo Queen and how her story is gl grossly overrepresented because she was a black woman and they wanted to un like they wanted to erode her literacy and own landowningness. 

Or Marie Laveau, Voodoo Queen. Mm-hmm. And how they wanted to make sure the blacks didn’t get the vote. Or the Portland Shanghai tunnels, where they wanted to denigrate the Chinese, but uh spoiler alert. 

Yeah, no. These are things. But I will say, at her request, at Mary Ellen Pleasant’s request, I’m in on this note, her tombstone describes her as quote, a friend of John Brown. 

Angie: I love that. At least she got one thing she wanted out of it. And I have pictures. I wondered if there was gonna be pictures. So she is sitting in a chair wearing exactly what you would think of the late 1800s. Um it’s medium collared, like not super high, but not low either. Um looks like a silk blouse with a wool skirt, maybe. Yeah. Her hair is very flat to her head, and she is thinking. She has some thoughts. 

Theresa: Well, that picture probably took thirty minutes to take, so don’t smile because your face is gonna fall like flat in a cupboard. Yeah. 

Angie: Okay, this one is definitely Civil War era. She’s got the Civil War era hair, the uh what is that, a crawl crawl chronoline dress, the the hoops? I think so, yes. Oh my gosh. Sha she have a pocket watch on that chain on her belt. 

Theresa: I think so. And so there is a certain phrase for like the that the the it’s like starts with the CH, but it has like it’s basically Victorian era like collection of things. Yes, you can have like whatever you know, like scissors or thimble or pocket watch in this case. 

Angie: Yeah, all the things and a little space for your money little. Yeah, yeah. That’s so cool. I love it. I would have loved to have seen what color that dress was. Obviously, it’s like a severe tone photo, so yeah. 

Theresa: And I will say, when you look up photos of her, there is going to be a photo of quote unquote her at a much younger age. It’s not, it’s mistributed to her. That photo apparently is of a young uh Hawaiian nobility. 

Oh one of the Hawaiian princesses around this time. Interesting. Okay. 

Wow. But that is the story of Mary Ellen Pleasant, and I didn’t even get into the go story because I refused to learn as soon as I realized all of the scandal that probably led up to it. Yeah, that’s fair. 

Angie: That’s true. I love that. I have a wildly different but equally awesome story for you. Have you ever heard the story of the ancient Celtic queen that gave the Romans a run for their money? 

Boudicca. Mm-hmm. Yes. I’m doing Boudicca today. Bring it. 

Are you are you prepared? All right. My sources. There are two historic UK articles authored by Ben Johnson. 

That feature either her or one of the battles that she was involved in. Um another another historic UK article uh from Terry Stewart, also about Boudica. The BBC has a really great site that uh is like archived. Um so not you don’t have to go on the internet way back machine, but it it’s still available on the BBC, but it’s like not a front page anymore. And this gives a short summary for all of the native tribes of Britain, and I was like, that’s actually super cool, because it gives you the location in like a paragraph or two little blurp. 

Like I could have spent forever there. Sotco.com has the Boudicca biography, history.com, Who Was Boudicca by Sarah Pruitt, English History Network, The Icingy Tribe, and believe it or not, the medium had an article. Boudicca Queen is their warrior folk hero. Yeah. 

I was like, okay, this works. Um and then Warfare History Network by Ludwig Heinrich Dyke, Britain Warrior Queen Boudicca. Um, so Boudica it is. So I was curious because we don’t have like our information on her comes from Roman historians. Um, and we only know of a handful of rulers before her. So I was kind of curious on like the background of her tribe and did my best to try to find some sort of information that kind of led us to the Romans. Um, but it’s mostly mostly archaeological. 

They didn’t leave a written record. So with that said, the Ifini were an Iron Age Britonic tribe located in the area of East Anglia. So their territory encompassed the area of present day Nofolk, parts of Suffolk, and even parts of Cambridgeshire. Now it does seem fair to say they are boarding other tribes. Like there are they’re surrounded by other tribes on at least three sides. And that seems strange to me to say that, but it also seems strange to not point out that there are in fact other people in Britain at the time. 

Theresa: Like, honestly, if you compare it to Native American humans, That’s exactly what my mind did. 

Angie: I was like, oh, well, no, that I guess because you have indigenous Americans that had multiple, multiple tribes living in similar areas. Why wouldn’t other ancient societies work the same way? Like okay, so their capital, I’m gonna try to say this one time and one time only was called Venata Acinarum, which is modern day Caester Saint Edmund. Um I am not so sure she spent a ton of time there, but maybe, but again, we don’t have a uh written record to know these sort of things. They would have been considered an incredibly wealthy people with interests in both metal work and horses. There have been some really informative archaeological digs around their territory that confirm their love of horses with related objects, as well as the fact that we know they minted their own silver coins. Whoa. 

Before the Rome. Crazy, right? Some of these coins feature imagery of horses, while other of these coins feature imagery of women and horses. So I’m like, okay, that’s actually super cool. Um and they would continue to make their own coins even after the Romans arrived. They have no written language, so like I said, we don’t have a ton of pre-Roman history other than these coins seem to imply that they are they have women of stature and were warriors as well, which checks. Alternatively, though, and I think this is really interesting, they do mark their coins with some type of initials of their rulers. 

Not really sure what that means as far as not having a written language, but they have some way of showing the name of their leadership. So it’s like, okay, that’s interesting. Not sure how that works. 

Theresa: I mean, I have a feeling it’s just like you look at the native tribes like prehistoric that had pictographs and things like that. 

Angie: Uh something like that, yeah. Um we also know that their territory produced some of the finest hordes of gold treasure found from the Iron Age. There have also been hordes located that feature these elaborately decorated bronze chariot fittings. Um the archaeologist archaeologists suggest that this is a way for them to display their talent and their goods, and they loved doing it. 

So I’m like, okay, so this in my mind, based on these finds, shows us a very wealthy, very stable. people. Yeah. Um but then the but then the Romans show up. So Yeah, here we go. 

Right, there goes the neighborhood. So we know, like I mentioned before, there were at least four rulers of the Icina of the Icenae before our point in the story. Um and and I’m just gonna say this m I am giving you the biggest oversimplification of her story humanly possible because if I didn’t, we would be here for six episodes. 

There is so much. So we think a couple of sources suggest she may have been born around 30 CE, but nobody’s definitive on that, so just around is what I’m saying. Um we don’t know anything of her parentage. We do know that she was likely from an elite family and would have been raised as a warrior like many of the other Celtic women over time, training in both technique as well as weapons, so that seems pretty consistent throughout. Unfortunately, we just know nothing of her childhood. Additionally, she would have seen the arrival of the Romans and how things were going for other tribes as well as her own, as the Romans are like making their way. At the early stages of her life, it’s not so much um conquest as it is more exploratory on the part of the Romans. Um but they’re always starts. Right. 

Theresa: Do you have things you want to we want to steal? You do. Fantastic. 

Angie: Pretty much. Um side quest because I was curious. Rome first sent exploratory missions and skull small scale raids as early as 55 BC under Julius Caesar. Good, and by these. I know, I was like, holy crap. I knew it was long because this has been an area assassination for me, but I didn’t realize it was that long. Um by 43 CE, the Emperor Claudius has ordered four legions to conquer Britain. Now, at any given time, a single legion could be up to twelve thousand people. That includes cavalry, auxiliary troops, and any other staff that’s going to be traveling with them. And there are four of those. That is potentially forty-eight thousand individuals just working their way through the countryside. 

Yeah. Um, Now, so that was that was my side quest about the Roman Legion, because I was like, Oh, yeah, I wonder how many oh like a legion contains. But um Budca marries the king of the Icini, and by sixty CE, just to jump forward real quick, they’re going to have at least two daughters together. 

But rewind. Here’s the thing about King Peseudicus. He eh, by 43, most of the tribes are forced to submit to this Roman rule, right? Because Claudius has sent these legions in, and it seems that Peseudicus has either bent the knee to Rome as an ally, like willingly, or was put on the Icini throne because Rome sees him as a peacekeeper. It seems to me that he was already the leader and just was like, okay, you know, it’d be better if we just worked with him as opposed to against them. 

Like let’s see how this benefits us kind of thing. Either way, he is sitting the throne of the Assini as a client king of Rome. To make a long story short here, Peseudicus works to keep his like everything he does is to keep his wife and daughters safe. 

Like that’s the long and short of it. He and Boudicca put things in motion with intent to secure their daughter’s rule and safety after they’re gone. But the other thing that bears mentioning is that this relationship with Rome is unstable at best. It’s not especially peaceful time as you can imagine. 

And like for the full visual here, um, which may be not necessary, but the Roman occupation sees an increase in settlements and military presence as well as attempts to put any to put the kibosh on any of the Celtic religious festival festivals. 

Theresa: So I’m not surprised. 

Angie: Shocking, right? And you can also imagine their relationship is going to be very um tenuous. Despite Pesudicus’s attempts to keep it peaceful for his daughters, Like it’s not an easy peace. Well, in 47, the R um oh excuse me, another thing I need to back up. Another thing that’s also happening around the time is some huge financial economic changes. There’s huge taxes being imposed on the peoples of Britain, as well as Rome granting money for projects that they will later turn around and call loans. 

Theresa: Oh, I love this. 

Angie: Right? So in 47, the Icini are less than happy about this and they throw a revolt. This leads to Rome forcing them to disarm and leading to even more big feelings on the part of the Icini, because now we’re unarmed and we are still be like the Romans are conscripting these tribal peoples into their armies, and they don’t want to serve them. Like the you came here. 

Theresa: Like what do you think you were a guest? This is my house. Right. 

Angie: Um, and so the surrounding tribes are not happy. Now, Peseudicus dies in sixty CE, and this is only the beginning of their problems because he’s given his kingdom to his daughter, to his daughters, but because by their law, women can rule. So this isn’t a problem for Peseudicus to be like, yeah, I have no male heirs, but I’ve got two daughters, so they’ll just take over. Like that’s fine. 

Yeah. Um but Boudica’s gonna serve as their regent till they come of age. But this is a problem for Rome because Rome doesn’t allow female rule. So enter a new player, in his attempt to keep the peace, he makes Emperor Nero his heir as well. Good. 

Theresa: I’m so grateful we have a stable leader on the throne for this. 

Angie: Right. Um and his whole idea is that if I make Rome my co-heir, my daughters will have their region, and Rome can do its thing, but my daughter should be able to reside in the peace that should come from this co-ruling. 

That’s his thought process. We all know that’s not how Rome works, but we know that now probably because of events like this, right? Um now Nero has been spending coin like crazy back home and he needs a way to refill the bank accounts. So, remember I said Rome’s been granting tribes these money, Peseudicus dies, and Rome comes to collect on those grants that they are now calling loans. 

The medium article says, quote, Rome declared since their agreement for protection and funding had been with King Pasodicus, and since he had died without male male heirs, everything belonged to them. You can imagine this does not sit well with Boudicca. Yeah. 

Yeah. Or or really anybody for that matter. Now the Roman governor of Britain, and I’m I’m sure I’m gonna mess up his name, but the Roman governor of Britain is a man called Suetonius Paulinus, and he decides that Peseudicus’s land and property need to be sacked and plundered, and that is exactly what happens. Like, just take it all. It’s ours. 

But just they don’t it’s not theirs anymore. Boudicca, for her part, already has big thoughts about these Romans, even being there, which is really obvious when you consider that her husband doesn’t directly put her in the will, hoping that his daughters will be able to continue to broker peace and protection and money from Rome. Bouddhica not being named is huge because it implies she already had a problem and she was already outspoken about it. Yeah. And Pseudocus is like, hey, um, we have to play nice, but she’s like, No, we don’t. Um I’m Buddhica. 

Theresa: As why you want to be. Yeah. Right. 

Angie: Um playing nice is in fact not what happens. Spoiler alert. The Roman governor, not content with just ransacking the place and taking the lands, takes it further by having Boudicca stripped, tied to a post, and publicly flogged while her daughters are raped. 

Other tribal leaders are treated similarly, and their families are then treated as slaves. This doesn’t go over well. Shocker. Um here’s the really interesting bit though. As a client kingdom of Rome, she would likely have been considered a Roman citizen, and this treatment would have been unthinkable. Right. 

So why they thought they could get away with this is wild to me, but here we are, I guess Nero being the emperor and Britain being so far away from the seat of power, like what are you gonna do? Now I love this. The Roman historian Cathy Zio describes Boudicca saying, quote, in stature, she was very tall, in appearance most terrifying, in the glance of her eye most fierce, and her voice was harsh. A great mass of the tawniest hair fell to her hips, around her neck was a large golden necklace, and I’m just like, do you have a crush on her? A little bit, right? 

Love this for you. The Roman historian Taddechus records Boudicca’s promise of vengeance, saying, quote, nothing is safe from Roman pride and arrogance. They will deface the sacred and will deflower our virgins, win the battle or perish. That’s what I, a woman will do. 

Theresa: Join or die, she basically did. 

Angie: Bouddhica then plans to burn the Roman world to the ground. Like full scorched earth, we don’t need it anyway. You guys are going. And the surrounding tribes follow her because they’ve all been treated the same way, and they think she’s right. Not only have they, like, as I mentioned, they’ve been heavily taxed, but the um Rome has been conscripting their young men into the army, and no one is happy with this Roman rule, so they want them out. And the rebellion forces, first sight that that they choose to like march in on is incredibly like it was most definitely chose for a reason, and it’s symbolic. 

This city features a temple to Claudius, the Emperor, who decided Rome needed to be in Britain in the first place. And I’m just gonna tell you Camelidunum is what it’s spelled as, and I listened to eight different versions of how to say it. 

Theresa: But I don’t I don’t even know how I would spell that. It just sounds like I wouldn’t even in some grimoire. 

Angie: Honestly, it’s like yeah, exactly. Now, not only is this the Claudius Temple sits there, but this land has the nearby lands had been taken from another of the tribes to support a basically a retirement home for Roman veterans to live in peace. 

So they’re like, okay. As the outskirts of the empire, Exactly. So um, I guess if you don’t want to go home, you can you can stay here and um live in the city. 

Theresa: It’s a long walk. 

Angie: It is a very long walk. Um so I kinda don’t want to I don’t blame them for wanting to stay. Um, but you know, here we are. Bouddhica and her army, as they are heading to this Roman city, they are picking up more and more fighters along the way, which I can imagine is what Aaron Burr was hoping to accomplish on its way down the Ohio River, but just missed the mark. Um, to say it’s no longer just a small icini force, but rather a very convine combined British one and they are pissed is an understatement. Like they are mad as hell and they plan to relieve the planet of these colonizers. 

Like they are done. And the area that they’re marching to this city that I am only going to pronounce in its its uh Latin once is the modern day Colchester. And according to some historians the army may by the time it arrived there may have big been as big as a hundred thousand strong. Good nice. But just keep back there in your noodle that this is not a well trained army. 

Theresa: Well and they’ve also been disarmed 

Angie: right so you’re dealing with like farmers and pitchforks. You’re not dealing with a legion that has been trained since birth to do this job. But they’ve got passion, they’ve got flair and they’ve got pitchforks or whatever farm tools you have, right? Some historians say that it may not have been as big as a hundred thousand but it was definitely in the tens of thousands. Either way it is a force to be reckoned with. 

Theresa: It’s more human than you want angry and marching at you. 

Angie: Yeah and the city is totally unprepared for what they’re about to endure. When the Roman veterans realize what’s marching their way they immediately send for help from Londinium and it but it’s already too late because like they’re there. 

We can see you, you know and there is no legion close enough and Londinium’s only able to send about two hundred men. Spoiler that is not enough. Yeah roll the dice that’s that’s what you get um it can’t even be called a fight. Boudicca and her army slaughter the lot of them there is no one left standing. People tried to flee and are caught and brutalized. 

There are historians according to Historic U UK that in this particular moment if you were a woman and you had been murdered at the hand of Boudicca’s um tribes your breasts would have been cut off and shoved down your throat. Oh damn yeah um people were literally hacked to bits where they stood or mowed down while they ran. There was no chance of survival they say that these lovely Roman grid streets literally ran with blood. Like that is not a like an understatement it there was blood everywhere and not even those that hid in the temple are spared because they are found and murdered one source says they are trapped in the temple as it burns no one is left alive. Like absolute full scale carnage slaughter. 

Yeah. Um and Boudicca’s army they take no loot. They’re just here to be like we we are serious about ruining your day and they burn the city to the ground. What is funny to point out is that if Roman leadership would have kept the fortifications maintained here would have at least been able to put up a fight. But they didn’t think they were ever really going to be a problem so they just kind of let the fortifications fall into disrepair and so they were easily over overruled, right? Like ten minutes of thought could have kept this from being an absolute massacre 

Theresa: um to be fair their coffers were running low. They had parties to throw 

Angie: honestly um and in a very oversimplified version of the next events they take Lundinium next rinse repeat of the prior events. However in this case there’s not many people left in Londinium including leadership either because they’re out on campaign or a tactical withdrawal. I just think They are like by what um what Warfare History Network says quote Boudicca’s horde poured into the defenseless city flames and destruction spread from the city center on Cornhill west to Luggett Hill. Tragically the majority of Londinium’s remaining citizens were the women and the old the Britons slaughtered all the most horrible tortures were inflicted upon the noble and distinguished women according to the if they were not killed outright female captives were taken to sacred groves of Andras and other deities um Boudicca’s like patriot gods, right? And they’re in what may have been very particularly brutal religious rites or Roman exaggerations of events you take your pick. 

Theresa: Little Columbia, Lilla Column B. 

Angie: Yeah their breasts would have been chopped off and sewn into their mouth sewn in. Yeah. 

Theresa: The other victims were taking time for arts and crafts. 

Angie: Honestly you work on your needlework. Um the victims were impaled by stakes lengthwise through the entire body according to the Roman historians. Now, I will I do want to point out that this is Rome we are dealing with and Rome has to have a proper villain if they’re going to be overthrown. 

Theresa: So propaganda’s key. Yeah. 

Angie: Propaganda is key, but either way, it’s it’s not gentle what’s happening, however you look at it. They would do a little bit of sacking, a little bit a little bit of looting, um there’s other towns in between. But about this time is when the rub Roman governor decides to make his way to the Roman military zone and meet her in the open. He, Setonius, assembles an army of ten thousand regulars and auxiliaries, and the and this bulk is made up of the fourteenth Legion. It’s roughly CE sixty sixty-one, and the most likely location for this battle where he is going to meet her is called Man Cheater near None Eaton. 

I’m not sure if I pronounced man cheater right, but I know I pronounced None Eaton right. Anyway, our girl looks up the hill to see her great enemy and how his men are positioned, and I just have this visual because she is in her chariot with her daughters. Yes. And she makes this really impassioned speech, according to the historian um Tatcus, saying, Quote, We British are used to women commanders in war. Though descended from bitey men, I am not fighting for kingdom and wealth, but for my lost freedom for my bruised body and my outraged daughters. The gods will give us the victory we deserve. The Roman legion dared to face us that dared to face us is annihilated. They will never face the din and roar of our thousands. You will win this battle of die. 

That is what I, a woman plan to do. He goes on to say that upon hearing this, Setonius says something to the effect of like, uh, don’t listen to them, it’s just women, throw your javelins. Like Boudicca roars and like all hell breaks loose, and it quickly descends into utter chaos. And eventually the Britons, their fighting spirit just leaves them before they like actually try to flee, like they are just so demoralized, and they’re blocked by their own families and caravans as they’re trying to get out of this battlefield. Wow. Because of how the how the area is designed, right? Like their their wagon train has become their fence. 

Theresa: Um Are the Roman trample your family or just get crushed. Yeah. 

Angie: The Romans slaughter everyone, including the animals. 

Theresa: The Romans slaughter everyone. Yeah. Oh, I thought you misspoke. 

Angie: No, the Romans see this chaos and they’re like, Oh, fantastic, because here’s the difference. You are dealing with a legion that has been trained that is dedicated and disciplined versus farmers who might this might be the first battle they’ve ever seen, and it’s chaotic already. 

Right. So there’s there’s this morale that’s just totally broken, and the Romans are like, fantastic, we can work with that. Throw more javelins. 

They’ve got more firepower, they’ve got dedication, they’ve got to training, and sometimes that passionate heart just needs a little bit more, and in this case that was one of those moments. By the end of her rampage of the towns, it’s believed her people took out something like seventy thousand. Which is insane. 

Yeah. Tadicus would later describe Boudica’s defeat as a glorious victory comparable to bygone trump triumphs. Roman reports estimated that up to eighty thousand Britons were killed. This number includes non combatants as well as the fighters. He goes on to say that the Roman casualties were about four hundred dead and just over four hundred wound wounded. The next sentence makes me laugh so hard because the visual I I have such a such a crap sense of humor. 

But when the news of the battle outcome reaches the second legion command and commander Postumus, he is absolutely overcome with shame for missing the battle, and he just stabs himself to death. And I’m like, What? 

Theresa: A little emotional intelligence. Yeah, he’s gotta learn some self-control. 

Angie: My guy Boudicca escapes along with a good number of her of her people, but here’s where things get a little murky. Tadchus wrote that she poisoned herself over defeat. Dio wrote that she grew ill and died. 

That seems unlikely, but perhaps she had sustained some sort of wound in the battle and it became infected, and then that’s it. And no one got his coming, she chooses suicide instead. Whatever the cause, her people mourn her greatly, and they give her the most worthy burial. Her valent efforts continue to inspire to the tribes despite the casualties suffer. Many refuse to surrender. Despite all that though, no other uprisings occur and things don’t get better until a more lenient governor shows up. And that is the story of Boudica. Wow. Have you seen the statue 

Theresa: that’s on the you’ve got an image. Just share it. I can I can tell already. Okay. It is a statue of a chariot. There are two horses in front. They are rearing up she has a spear in her left hand and her right hand is outstretched. Either way, that is that is the image of a commander. 

Angie: And her daughters are in the chariot with her. Oh yeah they’re but you can only see one in this picture. Um so that that’s the story of Boudicca. And um if you happen to be in London and want to see that statue it is positioned on the north side of the western end of the Westminster Bridge. That is fantastic. And I think it’s really funny that to me I was laughing about this while writing my notes I love Boudica. I love the story of Boudicca I’ve known it for a long time but um I think it’s hilarious that Britain has this folk hero that is all about fighting the 

Theresa: colonizer Yeah, that is a bit 

Angie: uh of… like huh maybe maybe just take a page from your own book I just Maybe made me chuckle. 

Theresa: Yeah maybe representation matters and we should really focus on certain stories more than others. 

Angie: Perhaps Well, if you need to focus on certain stories more than others and you appreciate podcasts like this that really surface those to the forefront of your mind review subscribe and send this to somebody else who both appreciates the story of the person attacking the colonizer and probably also racially identifies alongside them wild and on that note me. 

Angie: Goodbye